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Is it me or the board?

8K views 75 replies 19 participants last post by  f00bar 
#1 · (Edited)
I've had no trouble carving and stuff, I actually really liked it for hard shredding. But now that I'm trying out butters and stuff, I've had some trouble getting air off of ollies (or might just be doing them incorrectly) and getting my weight over my tail and stuff. I can tail press fine, just not as well as I would like for a butter. It's a rocker-camber-rocker board and a medium-soft flex of 4. Also having tons of trouble with controlling my board in the air and on rails
 
#2 ·
I'm 5' 1" and 102ish lbs. and have a 146 salomon wonder board. I was on a 140 rental some time ago and was gonna go for a 142. Is it too big?

I've had no trouble carving and stuff, I actually really liked it for hard shredding. But now that I'm trying out butters and stuff, I've had some trouble getting air off of ollies (or might just be doing them incorrectly) and getting my weight over my tail and stuff. I can tail press fine, just not as well as I would like for a butter. It's a rocker-camber-rocker board and a medium-soft flex of 4. Also having tons of trouble with controlling my board in the air and on rails ;-;
It's to big for you.
 
#4 · (Edited)
From the qualified snowboarding god...

Explain the reasoning for this please... Otherwise you are NO help at all...!

OP - Take the helpful comment by kosmoz in your stride, he knows nothing...

http://www.salomonsnowboard.com/gear/snowboards/wonder

The 146 is for riders with a weight between 99-143lbs, so while on the very bottom end, you will maybe find with time, and more experience you will work it out, or that maybe the board is just too stiff for you and your ability...

That is not to say you should give up on it, but try other boards as well, maybe a softer board in a 153 if you get the chance...
 
#5 ·
You have just answered by yourself. Girl is on the lowest side of weight for the board, tries to ride park and learn tricks and she is pretty fresh to snowboarding, how do you think, I was wrong or not?

153? Are you retard? It's almost her height and she is skinny girl :D
 
#9 ·
Based on the rest of his post you really thing he meant 153? Or maybe the 5 and 4 keys are right next to each other and it was a typo?


While weight can be a factor on board size, strength also has a lot to do with it. And strength and ability can always get better.

And really, I'd rather people learn on bigger boards, I'd rather ride all park on an all mountain sized deck than all mountain on a shorty park deck. I think most people are better off learning to ride park on an all mountain deck than all mountain on a park deck.
 
#13 ·
Why is size even an argument here. She said she wanted a 142, that is perfect.

She will gain the ability over time, once the ability is there she can get the 153 and ride park on it. Mr Lithuania is internet-angry I guess.
Are your skills there, you think you're good on snowboard? If yes, then go and get a board sized the same as your own height and ride it in the park. Cheers.
 
#15 · (Edited)
Will a shorter/less stiff board help her press easier? Sure, it'll let her cheat and allow her to press without actually using proper press technique. This isn't exactly a good thing though.

Is it necessary? No.

Can she press on her current board with good technique? Yes, she just needs to work on her press technique, that's all. Even with a shorter board she'll never be truly good at presses until she gets her technique locked down properly anyway.

Also - the 'up to your chin' rule is stupid and snowboards are sized primarily on weight not height.

OP - as far as butter tips go, the link in my signature gives you a free set of butter tutorials that should get you started.
 
#16 ·
Properly, you say... Until you are having fun - you are doing it right. In this case girl is struggling doing simple stuff. Let's put everybody on long stiff camber boards and start hating all flat, rocker, hybrid profiles with mellow flex and all god damn magnetraction technologies, because it's not proper boards, right?

Let's begin this from the start: board is rated 100-140 lbs, girl is on the bottom of the weight, she is also short, her skill , let's say, could be better. Learning is OK but in this sport having fun is more important.

http://www.gotceleb.com/wp-content/...ilje-Norendal:-Wallpaper---Sochi-2014--01.jpg

What does this picture is telling us? She must be doing it wrong :D

That rule does not apply for tall and skinny, they should go shorter, and does not apply for short and fat/muscular, who should go longer. For an average Joe that rule is pretty much correct.

I ordered 156 sabotage for 6"2 165 friend and 159 sabotage for 6"0 185 brother, I know the concept, don't worry.
 
#17 ·
Properly, you say... Until you are having fun - you are doing it right. In this case girl is struggling doing simple stuff. Let's put everybody on long stiff camber boards and start hating all flat, rocker, hybrid profiles with mellow flex and all god damn magnetraction technologies, because it's not proper boards, right?

Let's begin this from the start: board is rated 100-140 lbs, girl is on the bottom of the weight, she is also short, he skill , let's say, could be better. Learning is OK but in this sport having fun is more important.

http://www.gotceleb.com/wp-content/...ilje-Norendal:-Wallpaper---Sochi-2014--01.jpg

What does this picture is telling us? She must be doing it wrong :D

That rule does not apply for tall and skinny, they should go shorter, and does not apply for short and fat/muscular, who should go longer. For an average Joe that rule is pretty much correct.

I ordered 156 sabotage for 6"2 165 friend and 159 sabotage for 6"0 185 brother, I know the concept, don't worry.
She can do it right AND have fun and by getting the technique right she won't be blocking her own progression in the future.

Also, no one is saying gear changes wouldn't benefit her, but rather we're saying that gear isn't the main reason she's failing to press well right now. It's her technique and whether she changes her gear or not she still needs to get her technique right anyway if she wants to progress to other butters.

I hate the 'fun' or 'there's no wrong technique' argument. It seems to always come up when someone wants to preach some wrong technique or advice, then when people explain why their advice is wrong they fall back on the 'well there's no wrong technique - snowboarding is about fun!' angle.

It's so flawed because having fun and snowboarding in a way that allows you to learn faster and progress faster are not mutually exclusive things.

But whatever, I hate these stupid arm chair coaching arguments, I've said my piece.
 
#18 · (Edited)
You've completely missed the point on multiply occasions.

You googled one picture of a chick with a snowboard near her chin, bravo mate your google skills astound me. :eusa_clap: All other suggestions are clearly invalid - except, I suppose, the ones that are correct.

I don't know why you've started banging on about board profiles and magnetraction but good on you for knowing the difference between camber and rocker - I now feel completely confident that you're giving expert advice here. You won't find anybody here suggesting that everybody should ride stiff camber decks. We all ride different gear because it's what works for us.

I'm not going to re-explain why that rule is bullshit. Just go back and read mine or Jed's posts again and let it sink in a bit. :thumbsup:

Welcome to the forum, you've made a great first impression.
 
#19 ·
We all ride different gear because it's what works for us.
Words worth gold. So why this chick can't ride something shorter and softer? Why she should work her ass off learning uber correct techniques, when she can go shorter and softer and learn OK technique level? Current board does not work for her because of a combination of her physical givens and abilities. She can grow some muscle in gym and drill the techniques, but she can learn techniques in funier way. Final result won't be better but not everybody wants to be Shaun White.
 
#20 ·
Current board does not work for her because of a combination of her physical givens and abilities. She can grow some muscle in gym and drill the techniques, but she can learn techniques in funier way. Final result won't be better but not everybody wants to be Shaun White.


God, I try to stop posting in these stupid argument threads, but it's like crack. I see something stupid and it sucks me in to post.

Here's a question, why is your method more fun? What says she isn't having fun now and is just asking for tips and trying to figure out what's going on with her presses? Why does your method of making her buy entirely new gear mean she'll have more fun vs. the fix of solving the root of the problem in her technique.

Maybe she'll have a ton of fun doing it our way because learning the right technique will explode her riding and let her do the butters she always wanted to do and her being able to feel those sweet presses will give her so much more fun than doing crummy 'lean back' presses that don't feel right.

You're making so many assumptions and assuming she needs a new board to learn presses, when in reality almost every single freestyle student I've had who ran into pressing problems fails because they aren't pressing correctly, and not because their board was not short/soft enough.

Your solution right now is like someone coming to you and saying "Hey, my car won't go fast!" and your solution is buy a new car when their real problem was that they didn't know how to press the accelerator down properly. It's unnecessary, it's not a big deal that her board is a few cm bigger than the ideal for pressing.

Even if she buys a new board, I'm willing to bet you $1000 right now that she'll STILL have issues with pressing and will STILL have to learn to press correctly. So you haven't solved any problems, just delayed it slightly on the basis that she'll magically have more fun doing it your way.

Bleh, these threads make my head hurt. I should have stuck to my gut and not read the replies.
 
#21 ·
And you covered presses with a class, good job. Now do the same with 180s, 360s with a long board with big inertia.

Let's take k2 ultradream 168, rated 150+ lbs, would you recommend it for your students weighting 150-160 lbs to start with it?
 
#22 ·
With a class? Wtf are you on about? I teach snowboard freestyle for a living as my full time job, what do you do again?

For the record, I have taught 180s, 360s and heck 540s to people on powder boards. It's not the gear, it's almost always the rider and the mistakes they're making. Gear helps, but techniques is far more important than spending tons of money to constantly have the perfect gear.

And as I said already, no one is saying she wouldn't benefit from a slightly smaller board, in fact, I agree she would benefit from going a tiny bit smaller, but what we're saying is that spending $300 for a board that's a few cm smaller is way overkill for her problem.

You're taking this to extremes for no reason. Putting someone on a super stiff board that's 15 cm too big for them is not the same as someone whose board is a few cm bigger than the perfect size for pressing.

Also, here's a fun video of what happens when good technique meets the the wrong gear (and her problem isn't even in the same league as this video.. we're talking a few cm off ideal vs. riding the completely wrong gear):

https://vimeo.com/92295301
 
#23 ·
To The OP

My wife rides a 144 pretty stiff posi camber deck and weighs about 10 kilos more than you.

I have a couple of friends who are in your weight range here in Japan and they ride a 138 and a 140.

Now if you want to go fast and carve hard, longer and stiffer is better.

Neni a female member here rides boards way longer than her "weight range" and seems to love them, not to mention she has skills and rips spines in Alaska.

Still from everything you have told us about what you want to do you wouldn't benefit from going long for your weight.

I would say get a 140 or 142 and enjoy it.

I think there is something to be said for learning on slightly longer camber decks, I see where the rest of the guys are coming from, but at 100lbs you just won't have the weight or strength to push a longer board around as easily, especially when it comes to tricks.

Yes you could bulk up, strengthen up and do all sorts of tricks on a longer deck.

Then again why bother when you can ride a 142 and still carve (not extreme but you can carve perfectly well) and learn your desired tricks significantly easier.

As everyone has mentioned your skills are way more important than the board, but its better to be on the right board to maximize your enjoyment and learning curve.

Learning and improving fast = more fun and more likely to stay with snowboarding.

My two Yens worth.

Whatever you do enjoy it:laugh:.
 
#24 · (Edited)
It's You! ;) That board is only making things a bit more,... "challenging" for you is all! (I think this thread would be a good candidate for reposting the "Pinewood Derby" vid!) ;) :thumbsup:

As I read the specs for that board, It is a true twin shape with directional flex. Which, if I recall means the tail should be stiffer than the nose. Also Saloman's web site says the stance is slightly set back from center.

...That along with you being at the bottom of the weight range for that length? All of those things would tend to make it just a bit more difficult to press that board easily. Not impossible,.. just a bit more difficult! Proper form and technique will help you with learning how to do that.

Also,.. if you can ride switch at all? You might try pressing the board riding switch and see if it isn't a little easier to press. Since the nose should be easier to flex!


-edit-
I decided to post that "Got Wood?" vid myself for the OP! This vid showcases the reason why Everyone agrees with the contention that it's always the rider & not the board! ;) (Besides,... I just love watching this video!! It's plain Ol' frickin' Awesome!!) :D

...also, this link, Misc buttering & Snow Porn clips, is where I reposted a ton of Ryan Knapton's Buttering tut's so I could download and refer bacvk to them. Hope they help you to learn to press properly! :thumbsup: :D

 
#25 ·
Ooops did i really post 153 instead of 143...! Sorry, i definitely meant 143...!!!

But the sensible people knew what i mean anyway... Haha
 
#26 ·
Ooops did i really post 153 instead of 143...! Sorry, i definitely meant 143...!!!

But the sensible people knew what i mean anyway... Haha
Sensible People??? On the Interwebz???? LOL!!! :laugh::laugh::laugh: :thumbsup:
 
#28 ·
Can't tell anything else just Lithuania? So I am in those 1% because I instantly noticed the difference in riding between 159 sabotage and 159 man's board, same bindings. Why don't you ride some kind of 168board all mountain and park?
 
#36 · (Edited)
The difficulty with butters was swinging my board around in those 180s...maybe it's just that I don't have enough leg muscle but I skate and my legs have never failed me in strength even for tre flips..
If you are having trouble spinning with your butters a good technique I use is to start the spin before the butter to get some momentum generated. I personally found going front side easier but that's just personal preference.

First I start with weight equal on both feet and start sliding/skidding on my heel edge going into what would be a front side spin but without the board leaving the ground. As I get to the 45-90 degree angle, I start shifting all my weight over my back foot while boning out my front leg to get into the press.
After that it's just about shifting ever so slightly from heel to toe so you don't catch your downhill edge and this will also help keep the spin going for as long as you can balance it. I have done as many as 15+ rotations buttering on my back foot like this and is pretty easy once you get the hang of it. This was the first type of butter I learned how to do and it has opened and all kinds of variations, which are pretty much endless.

Here's a video from 3 winters back where you can kinda see me doing it at around the :10 second mark. It doesn't exactly show the very beginning of the butter but you can kinda get what I'm talking about from it.

 
#33 ·
Does this qualify him to be nationalist?

Since when being on the lowest weight range is OK for beginer in snow park? Why you are so sure, that girl, who created this topic, bought that board new and won't get some money back when selling it?

Saw some of Jed videos, didn't notice him riding something 170+, why?
 
#34 · (Edited)
Saw some of Jed videos, didn't notice him riding something 170+, why?

Jeebus Please Us!!!!!

The 3-4 freakin' cm's difference she's been talking about isn't anywhere near the same as you arguing that one of these guys should "Ride a 170cm!!" AND, the fact is, some of these guys could and would ride that 170!!!

Did you even watch the vid I embedded?? Those guys hit boxes and jumps ridding freaking 2x4's!!!!. FFS it's the riders skill Not the damned board that is the real determining factor.
If she's learning and progressing with a "challenging" board? Her overall riding skills will only benefit from that!!! I know for a fact mine did! :huh:
 
#35 ·
Btw uuhpunkk, if your trouble is with getting the board to swing around for pressed or ollied 180's etc? It's likely that it really is mostly a matter of skill, technique and timing!

I learned to ride on a 163W, stiff assed, cambered deck. I now have two other boards. 159 & 157! They are both WAY lighter and softer than my Arbor! Technically? They should be, (...and are in fact) easier to swing around.

BUT,.. I cant ollie or nollie a freaking 180 off of them to save my life! :D :giggle: My timing and technique for doing that sucks ass right now! I can press and do a pressed spin 180 with all 3 boards. Regular and switch. But I can't pop, ollie, or nollie a decent spin off any of them!

Why? My "skills, my timming" isn't there yet! :dunno:

You're doing the right thing by practicing, on and off the snow! Keep doing that, watch & learn from Jeb's & Ryan's video tuts. You'll get it! :thumbsup:

Best of luck to you!!
 
#39 ·
Lol! :bowdown: Just Awesome!

So I seems Kevin was closer to the actual number. Figure guys around here riding an average of 3 boards ea. (...just an arbitrary pick for that average number.) Gotta figure more than a few guys doing 4-5-6 boards ea, and I'm guessing most are probably only riding 1-2 a season!

That would mean BA's riding more decks a season than 30 or more of us put together! :thumbsup:
 
#40 ·
Kevin Jones
Name: Kevin Jones
Sponsors: Billabong, Bern, Bluebird, Union, DVS
Years riding: 22 years and no plans on stopping any time soon
Hometown: El Dorado Hills, CA
When Not Riding: Skateboarding, flyfishing
Local Mountain: Jackson Hole Mountain Resort
Music: Willie nelson to slayer, Been into mastodon, of montreal, and wilco lately
Favorite Snowboard: KJ 149, KJ 159

Compatriot Snowboards | Kevin Jones » Compatriot Snowboard Company

folks, meet strokes. they're different. personally if i were you i'd go shorter and softer... insert stroke joke here.

insert insertion joke here.
 
#42 ·
Well, who told that 142 is ideal size, especially for a park? Why you are calculating 4cm difference from 146 to 142? I would say 138-140 is excellent sizing for a girl. K2 limelight 138 is good up to 130lbs and 140 bottom weight is 90, plus she is "not very tall " :)

Diff between 140 and 145 isn't the same as between 160 and 165, calculate in percentages. I was putting 170boards not to emphasise, but because if a regular Joe is 5"10 and 155lbs he falls in weigh range exactly the same as girl does with her 146 board, plus she is taller than her board by 7cm, just like 5"10 Joe would be taller than 168-170 board.

But please, keep hating and braging about how many boards you have ridden.
 
#43 ·
plus she is "not very tall " :)
What planet are you from...!!! Height has nothing to do with a board... A board cannot tell how tall a person is...!!! It can however tell how much someone weighs...

And it is still not a given, but a guidance...!
 
#47 ·
I could ride 175board or even an ironing board and will result in better(?) skills when go back back to normal sizing, but do I need that? Do I or someone else need to learn to drive a lorry or Ford F750 to be able to drive a 335i?
 
#49 ·
Which of my statements are stupid? Why we don't see any pro riders in halfpipe or slopestyle with 160+ boards, which could be riden by any 140lbs+ which is less, sometimes much less, than most of your wives and girlfriends do weight :D

Why pro riders tend to be near the top of boards recommended weight range?
 
#50 ·
Toy Competition event Fictional character Photo caption Super bowl


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