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post #43 of (permalink) Old 01-25-2013, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Extremo View Post
Yeah, I understand this, but if Jonny Gapeass is the hope of the industry, snowboarding is in some trouble.

When I was growing up (early to mid 90's) not one kid in my neighborhood didn't have a snowboard. We didn't ride resorts, we rode backyards, prep school hills, and golf courses. Now, nobody does. My son's going on 11 and he doesn't know anyone else in his grade that snowboards, affluent or not (quite a few ski). With all the second hand gear out there you'd think access to snowboarding would be easier than ever. You can get $100 board/binding/boot set ups all over craigslist. As a kid from a working class family who grew up on used (and relatively high priced) gear this would have been a dream. If poor = core, kids should be snowboarding every hill in the area, stealing street signs to jib up at the prep school. The spots that use to draw huge snowboard crowds every day after school when I was growing up now don't have a snowboarder in sight. Snowboard culture is suffering. And if Jonny Gapeass is going to be the face of the brand, I'm not sure too many people are going to follow.
Well the industry is definitely in trouble as a whole companies are starting to just now address this, but it may be a bit too late.

Core = poor and that refers to the "core" market that companies try to market too with the cool graphics, edgy shit, blah blah blah. There's just not enough of the die hards to financially be feasible but this will always be the face of the brand. I mean how could a guy with gaper gap and a backpack make snowboarding look "cool". It's just that the first influences the latter and the latter finances snowboarding so the first can exist. It's a somewhat symbiotic relationship.

Now being poor and snowboarding that's a different thing entirely. I do agree that there are cheaper set ups on craigslist than when you and I were kids. The problem I see here for kids in that age bracket is how fucking lazy they are. I used to live with a guy that had a 15 year old, that kid as defined by the state of CO something or other said that 4 in 5 of his classmates would die/get adult onset Diabetes by the time they were thirty and 3 in 5 are currently morbidly obese. It's just a health issue that I see with a vast majority of kids.

Originally Posted by blunted_nose View Post
Im fine with snowboarding going lower in numbers. What i mind is that big companies will stick around while smaller dubs will go under. Why dont we all start making our own snowboards?

And theres always burton...
Eh the snowboard industry is actually on a collision course for a culling of the herd. Some big companies will disappear, others will get bought up, some will die a slow agonizing death. This is where small and medium brands could thrive or just die. It's key in their marketing and how they prepare themselves for the next 3 years.

Now if you're talking about the micro brands that buy a press of they will always exist because they're hobbyists that just put too much thought into building a board.

Originally Posted by wrathfuldeity View Post
There is a market for CORE geezers,...arcteryx, sled, cat, heli...but they are also getting pfs or have the cash and don't need it. However regular geezers....due to our experience of families and bills, we are rather savvy buyers. We may or not have more disposable income but I'd suspect we want functional quality more than bling shit. I'm a cheap sob and rarely buy anything new let alone at full msrp. However being a geezer does allow more choice via awareness/experience to pick, choose and spend less. This past summer I got the shit bc kit, all the tools and even an I anticipate not spending much for quite a few years...beyond a season pass and could even forgo that and just hike and would only be buying gas.

Anyway besides the economy, less time/money, sedentary lifestyle trend....there is also less snow. Thus the scarcity factor is in play. I could safely say that, if I lived 3 hours away from the hill I would only go a few times a year if at all.

Snowboard vs should be inclusive...with fatty twin free ski it's just a matter of preference. Skiers imho do have a better platform and equipment for all terrain and conditions except for deep poo but the fatties have nullified that snow condition. Yes skiing equip cost more and easier to learn but sb is less of an entry fee. Over the past 10 years I've seen both ebb and flow. Perhaps what is new is that us geezer boarders are getting older and there are more of us.

Thus we who take up the sport later are probably not going to buy highend shit because we won't use its capacity, but more so we value the experience of just being on the hill instead of having all the latest and greatest shit. At least for myself and the snowboard industry is not making much or any money off me.
Your generation is the gnarliest in my perspective. You guys are foregoing resorts to head to the BC which is the fastest growing percentage of snowboarders and usually the one that gets overlooked by marketing groups that spout about our death. By not going to resorts you're not getting polled by their people. You also invest a huge chunk of cash initially then it's replace as needed because the gear is just built so much more beefy.

Originally Posted by Engage_mike View Post
I love this message board!!

I think the article is headed in the correct direction when it speaks of the age range in which the sport got hot...Snowboarding is SOO young compared to the sport of skiing and I believe what keeps a sport (or what I usually am arguing about, a team loyalty) is time....
you figure with skiing there have been several generations now that have told themselves, " I am going to get my kids skiing with me on our future vacations." that 1 skier has now produced a flock of 3 kids that I now have my first child and have vowed to myself to get good enough on my snowboard to show her how to snowboard...(Although if she takes to skiing I'm cool with that as well ) So its up to us 30 + year olds that are raising children to get them "STOKED" on the sport for it to continue to grow...its all in TIMES hands I believe (IF this was already spoken about I'm sorry if I missed the reply but I can't read every single reply)
...Mr. Avenger...I always love your are a hell of a writer and I love to see your rants and logic behind each one
This pretty much sums it up as well. What we do have on our side is the Not Dads or Rad Dads depending on who you ask. This is Extremo's group. Guys in their mid 20's to mid to late 30's that were snowboarders in the golden age and die hards. As more of these guys pop out kids the more we'll see them pushing the child towards snowboarding cause that's what dad does. I figure it's at least 5 to 8 years now before we see the next cyclic growth from this group.

The other reason we're all overlooking about skiing going up is that freeskiing is the new shit. It's just now developing its icons and hero's. Think about snowboarding say 97 to 03ish those years we had a lot of things going on. They're going through it as well right now and it's this growth factor with the "new" image that is bringing kids in. Basically it's not your dads version of skiing anymore.

Originally Posted by Soggysnow View Post
I'm finding you are missing another core group in your discussion.

The seasonaires.

They work minimum wage for the resort, spend their money in bars-own by the resort and buy their latest snowboard gear that they are crazy stoked on in the stores owned by the resort.

Tell me the resorts are not making money from this group...their paychecks are recycled and overdrawn.
Im not even talking about people who have been around for a season, many of those people come, stay and make it their lives, have kids and will survive on their measly wage to go snowboarding.

I know this, because I am one. I definitely keep the industry alive, when visitor hear how happy and stoked I am, they get stoked too. They go to the restaurants I recommend and drink at the bars I mention. They listen when I tell them who the best bootfitters are and where to get their new jackets from....

I think everyone keeps the industry alive. If the kids weren't about making things 'cool' then new people wouldn't get into the sport.
Once a skiier/snowboarder, hooked for life.
Seasonairies don't do shit to boost any economy, they're more of a blight than anything. They drop the "I'm local" card after 2 weeks of living here. Live off the cheapest food possible, don't tip, can barely afford to go out, blow their load on last years gear that's marked down 50 plus percent. If anything snow carnies are little more than a afterthought.

Sorry but you're just nothing special.

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