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Malavita EST vs Cartel EST vs Genisis EST

85K views 109 replies 41 participants last post by  ekb18c 
#1 ·
All on a 152 Easy Livin. 150lbs, 22 wide, 18/-12, size 9 Flow Hylites.

After riding all three back to back the Malavita is the overall stiffest. The frames of the Mala and Gen are the same and a littlse softer than the Cartel becaue of the Hinge. But with the way the Hinge works, though it softens them up a bit tip to tail, they're both still a little more responsive. The hinge lets you direct more energy to the tips.

Genesis:
The best way I can find to decribe the highback is all the benefits of a urethane back without any of the faults. You dont feel it on your boot but its there 100% when you drive into it. When you push through the side it does give, so compared to its "predecessor" the Prophecy it is not as aggressive or responsive. With the way Burtons Flying V works this isnt too much of an issue though. With the extra bit of rocker outside the camber zone you're really directed more towards driving the board with centered weight. So you aren't really driving into the outside of the highback much since when you try you just sort of wash out unless your super on top of it and in grippy conditions. So, these are a comfy responsive all mountain freestyle binding. On a cambered deck or something you can really drive into the tail on the highback will be more of a factor.

Cartel:
It rides softer. Like with the Genesis it isnt really different driving through turns on Flying V. Where you feel the softness is playing around on your tips. In my opinion for Burtons direction this is exactly what they needed to do with the Cartel. The last couple years its been more an all mountain/freereide feel, giving it just a bit of softness to the inside brought it back to the all mountain/ freestyle killer it used to be. In my opinion it is the best Cartel yet. Without the hinge it just felt like a more precise ride and for a higher end jumper the hingeless frame I think makes more sense. Its just a bit more accurate.

Malaita:
The whole idea of riding your ankle strap a click or two looser because of the hammock is sound. I felt more comfortable in the binding that way and felt like it rode more the way it was designed. In reality this was the stiffest of the three. The highback just makes that difference. Again, on Flying V you really only notice it when playing around. It's stiffer to the inside and makes for manipulating the board more powerful. For the higher end park rider that likes a bit more of a skate pop these are money. Otherwise they are a great do anything binding with a good chunk of response and a dash of playability with the Hinge.

ReFlex:
This changes some things. I didnt ride the ReFlex version, but the Mala and Gen have the same baseplate. So in realtion to each other they just both get an equal amount stiffer. Not much, just a hair really. But with the Cartel since it doesnt have Hinge in EST the overall feel of the binding is more or less just the difference between EST and ReFlex. So since the Mala and Gen get a bit more precise and the Cartel basically stays the same, the relation between the three changes between EST and ReFlex.

Overall how I'd categorize the three:
Malavita EST-High end park rider that likes a little more skatey pop or a general all mountain comfy ride.
Malavita ReFlex-High end parkk rider, solid comfy all mountain ride.
Cartel EST-park destroyer who knows what they're doing and wants some precison.
Cartel Reflex-Park destroyer who likes some more play in the highback.
Genesis EST-Rides everything, long days, and not afraid to spend $$.
Genesis ReFlex-Responsive binding for someone that liked the idea of a urethane highback but thought they were just a bit too loose.

For matchups with decks I think the Cartle and Gen depend on how the board is meant to be ridden. They'll feel softer on boards you drive into the tips more with and "stiffer" on boards you stay more centered on. Straight back the response between the two was minutely different with the Gen being just bairly more relaxed. The two part back and all.
 
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#40 ·
I just ordered a new Custom X to replace my 2010 version. I was about to order the Malavitas as well but hesitated due to so much reading about them being more freestyle oriented than freeride. But if they are as stiff as you say perhaps I need to jump on a pair while they are selling for cheap
 
#42 ·
The diodes are super comfortable despite appearances, especially if you have big calves.

The secret to adjusting the forward lean is to make it parallel by adjusting the outside screws first, make it loose enough to click and not so loose it's about to fall off. Then remember that position and adjust both sides equally one click at a time for forward lean. Make sure you periodically tighten those screws.

The annoying things about diodes are ice build up, foam tend to come off, and the lean adjuster marks will rub off leaving only carbon fiber.
 
#43 ·
For the big guy on the 66 of these options definitely the Malavita. But realistically I'd be looking elsewhere outside Burton. If you're looking for stiffer bindings that are going to get out to 15's you dont want Burton anyway. They start to get tough at about 13 and the reflex disc provides very little binding centering. You are much better off in something like Targas or Capos.

To the new Custom X, Malavitas or Diodes. Being full camber you'll be driving into your contact points a lot which means you need a torsionally stiffer binding. The Cartel just wont let you push through turns the way the X wants you to.

The Malavita gets marketed as a freestyle binding casue 2 years ago compared to the Cartel that's what it was. It hasnt changed, but the Cartel has. Honestly Burton is missing a binding in there line. You go from a decent all mountain freestyle binding, the Malavita, to an ultra stiff high price freeride binding in the Diode. The Genesis only replaced the Prophecy/C02 in price and they need something to replace it in performance as well. There's a gap. A gap in which they had a great hold on the market in the past.
 
#44 ·
For the big guy on the 66 of these options definitely the Malavita. But realistically I'd be looking elsewhere outside Burton. If you're looking for stiffer bindings that are going to get out to 15's you dont want Burton anyway. They start to get tough at about 13 and the reflex disc provides very little binding centering. You are much better off in something like Targas or Capos.
Funny that you just posted this; I ordered some Capos literally 10 minutes ago after chatting with Leo about this on Saturday and trading PM's with him today. I like Burton, but since the two of you know your shit and have basically suggested the same model(s), I'm going to go with the Rides even despite the bad stuff I've heard about their customer service. Realistically, they do seem to be the best option for me here.

I thought of reaching for the El Hefe's, but figured they'd be overkill for my board and skill level at this point, even despite my size. I'm assuming that I'm going to notice a big enough difference already between the Capos and my old Missions (those guys are getting slapped on my old board to use as a junker).

Thanks for taking the time to reply, it's much appreciated.
 
#46 ·
Interesting comparison and review, especially if you rode them back to back...

I wasn't going to update my old bindings but saw a good deal and so I just bought myself 2013 Malavitas (Reflex non-EST) today ( it's $156 at Dogfunk! malavita from Dogfunk.com ) I returned a pair of 2013 Cartel Limited EST (i.e. Malavita base) and I recently bought 2013 Genesis EST...

Would be good to go out and test them out but alas, winter is almost over... I'll chime in when I get some runs in on these bindings...
 
#48 · (Edited)
Got the 2013 genesis for $155 plus tax at evo. Been riding the prophecys all yr so ill try to write up the differences. Going twice this weekend.

SKUItemQtyAmount
EB-56850-1005Burton Genesis Snowboard Bindings 2013 L, Darkness1209.96
cc_Price MatchPrice Match -53.99
Subtotal155.97
Shipping Cost (Will Call - Fremont)0.00
Tax (WA_SEATTLE 9.5%)14.82
Total$170.79
 
#50 ·
Hi Trapper,

I have to second Nivek's opinion. Based upon my understanding the Malavita Reflex is stiffer than the Cartel Reflex. What confuses the question is when comparing the same model in EST; then it becomes Cartel EST is stiffer than Malavita EST. Nevermind comparing the restricted and the limited vs. the base models.

Hope this helps - Nito
 
#52 ·
Appreciate that, but as I mentioned I went ahead and grabbed a pair of Capos. All in all I am happy with this purchase, though I am still on the fence about their long-term durability. We'll see.

But in general I still think it was worth mentioning on your part so as to help others clear up any confusion they might have as well. So thanks again.
 
#51 ·
I bought the reflex malavita and am happy with the purchase. Prior to the purchase I went to the ski shop and played around with the mala / cartel / diode to test their flex. High back on the mala is noticeably stiffer than the cartel but not as stiff as the diode. Tho the malavita is being marketed as a freestyle binding and has the same flex rating as the cartel , I think it's the missing link between the uber stiff diode and freestyle cartel. Makes for a perfect match when paired with my '13 Billy goat as a free riding setup.
 
#54 ·
It's quite mind-boggling the amount of variations in their bindings, isn't it? Limited, Restricted, ReFlex, EST @..@ It doesn't help that they mix and match parts from different bindings into other bindings...

When checking them out at the store, and you flex the high backs torsionally (i.e. by twisting them from the top with your hands), there is no doubt that the cartel is the most flexible, then the genesis, then the malavita, then the diode. However, when you try to flex the high backs back and forth (toe to heel side), then it's hard to tell with just your hands and not mounted on a board. This is where "real-life" testing comes to play.

I've found that the 2013 Malavita Reflex (non-EST) is the stiffest and most responsive edge to edge, then the 2013 Genesis EST, then the 2013 Cartel Limited EST. (I just ordered some last-year stock 2013 Cartel Reflex today).

I tried these combos with my boards:
2013 Malavita Reflex on 2012 Rome Artifact Rocker (which is a uber-soft rocker-flat-rocker butter/park board)
A decent combo and rideable, but the binding felt like it was a bit too much for the soft board. This season I'm going to pair the board with Cartel Reflex which I think will be a much better match.

2013 Genesis EST on 2013 Burton Custom Flying V (hybrid camber)
The perfect match! Very comfortable binding, good control for carving, yet flexible enough to be comfortable. It's a good all-arounder. Just like my new board, it's great at everything. I've never broken a high back (always put them down when getting on lift), but I do see what people mean about flimsy 2-part back that could break or separate if you're careless...

2013 Malavita Reflex on 2008 Burton Custom X (very stiff camber board)
Much better match than with my noodle stick. Very responsive and stiff, really works well with the stiff camber bomber board. It's also very comfortable. The ankle strap has a lot of cushioning and the back is very cushioned, so I can bomb runs all day long and it's very comfortable. I used to ride both feet in positive angles (like hard boot carvers), but I started experimenting with different angles last season, and I found that these bindings even with negative angle on the back foot is still easy to control (just had to rotate the high-back to be parallel with the board). Not sure if that's my ability to compensate for different stance or the binding, but the binding gives me confidence on this board. Very happy with this combo. I considered the Burton Diode or Ride El Hefe or used Burton CO2s, but they were very pricey.

(2013 Cartel Limited EST on 2013 Custom Flying V (hybrid camber))
I tried this combo for one day, and the bindings were not the right size (which is why I returned/exchanged them) so I can't say much about them. I think the Genesis felt more responsive if not about equal. It did have very comfortable ankle straps too.


Cliff Note Version:
Stiffness: Malavita Reflex > Genesis EST > Cartel Limited EST > Cartel Reflex
 
#55 ·
Great Breakdown! I have been out a couple years due to health issues. I have been riding a TRS with Targas and Fargo's. I have been doing some research and am looking to go light. I recently purchased a Custom Flying V and K2 Maysis boots. I still like the stiff Targas but they are heavy compared to new bindings. I was leaning toward Genesis est but sounds like the Malavitas would be more responsive. Have you tried the Malavitas on your Custom Flying V? Appreciate your Feedback. Thanks
 
#56 ·
So not owning anything burton in years has left me in the dark as to how far they have evolved. I have decided to go with the 162 trick pony, but am still unsure which bindings would maximize the boards potential even after reading through this thread. Niven or someone with experience, can you recommend a binding for me? Thanks. FYI my current pow set up is 163 sick stick with spi, which are stiff. Looking to tone it down a notch. Groomer play set up is attack banana with contact pro. I'd like to slot the burton set up between these two. Cheers.
 
#64 ·
Mostly wrong. Mission has the same baseplate and a stiffer highback than the current Cartel (highback is same as on the 2011-12 Cartel).
True on the ratchets (not dual component), but doesn't really matter.

Biggest differences are actually the 'comfort features' - Cartel has a nicer ankle strap, autocant footbed, and cushioning gel in heel area.
 
#67 ·
cartels are my "preference"

it is fair to say that these will all depend on your riding style and preference of feel. in all fairness the price difference shouldn't be there, they are all equally high quality bindings with separate perks. alot of pros ride cartel alot of pros ride malavitas it is all style and preference
 
#71 ·
Long time lurker!

So how about Malvita Reflex vs Cartel Reflex vs Genesis Reflex 2014 models?

Been riding a pair of 2013 Restricted Reflex Cartels which coming from my 09 Customs have been a treat, but I just got a steal on a pair of 2014 Reflex Genesis and after reading this thread and other websites i cannot wait to try these things based on the comfort people have reported.

Only thing is I'm worried I will feel the difference in response coming from the Cartels and I did like the idea of Autocant, although I'm not sure you can really feel it?

Only other option is to frank a Genesis/Cartel combo? Genesis with Cartel hi back and vita Autocant bed or Cartel with Genesis straps?

Also whats the deal with the Gettagrip capstrap vs lightweight Gettagrip capstrap? Apart from been lighter and having more of a foam liner vs rubber?
I presume the lightweight is better as its on the higher end models???

If it makes a difference I'm on a 2013 K2 Happy Hour so hopefully the Genesis will suit the board better and be a bit more playful?
 
#72 ·
i would love some feedback also. i have the 2014 genesis reflex on a arbor blacklist and personally love it. they are really comfortable and the response is great. i ride park and all mountain on the same board although i just bought a 2014 never summer cobra and plan to ride the same same bindings because i heard these bindings are great for all
 
#73 ·
okay so I picked up a new 162 trick pony 2014 and just ordered Malavita est. a

I am upgrading from a bullet and customs.

weigh 240 6'1 and freeride most the time, not a big fan of the park but like to freestyle on mountain.

any thoughts on if the set up will be ok?
 
#74 ·
Hey guys.

I have a 2013 Burton Aftermath w/ Channel (Camber flex rating: 5).

Currently have custom reflex bindings, they did the job last season. I ride all mtn (park, speed runs, carving, powder days when available).

Want something more high performance then the custom to get the most out of this board...

Any suugestions?
 
#75 ·
For exceptional all around performance and great comfort: Genesis. The two part highback rocks.

For uber stiff, uber light, uber responsive, uber expensive: Diodes. (Still pretty comfy)

I run both, genesis for powder, diodes otherwise. Personally I think that stiff bindings aren't as important in pow, you can easily press the edges, while stiffness matters for slicing up groomers.
 
#79 ·
Hey Nivek...
For a Burton Fish, Genesis vs Malavita? (EST)

I think Gens are perfect, but I already have Genesis ReFlex, so I doubt i'd also get Genesis EST.

So would it be worth it to go 2016 Malavita EST just for what the EST brings? or might as well just slap the ReFlex Genesis and not care about EST? or get something else like Flux DS, Now Select, Contact Pro?
 
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