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Old 09-02-2014, 02:54 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Burton Cartel ReFlex sizing (M or L)..?

Just posted this as a reply to a question in another thread, but figured I'd post this in it's own thread to make it easier to find since I've seen so many questions about whether to get Medium or Large size in the Cartels. Maybe this will help someone out before they buy the wrong size...

- Remember that w/ Burton bindings you are stuck with what the holes in the disks give you as far as moving the binding "port to starboard" (and the older ones had 5 choices as far as what holes you could use, the newer ones only give you 3)...

IMHO, Large Burton bindings (in the Cartel at least), w/ smaller-footprint boots, are for maybe more like Size 12+. If you're in that size 10.5-12 range, do yourself a favor and check a M/L Cartel with your boots before you buy...

For reference: I have a pair of the Thirty-Two Lashed in Sz. 13 and w/ Cartels in Large, and using the screw holes closest to the back of the disks (holes nearest to the highbacks, pushing the bindings as far forward as you can with them), it puts the boots centered about perfect (equal heel/toe overhang).
I know Burton says their bindings in Large are for 10+, and I had expected to at least have to use the middle of the three "overhang-adjustment hole" choices in the discs for a Sz.13; but if I do w/ these boots, it's all heel-overhang and the toes of the boots barely poke over the edges...

Pics are worth 1000... '13/'14 Cartel ReFlex + '13/'14 ThirtyTwo Lashed size US13 (rear binding at -6, and the Capstrap toe-strap makes it look like there's more toe overhang than there actually is...)
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Last edited by CK1000; 09-02-2014 at 03:16 PM.
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Old 09-02-2014, 03:11 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Great post.

I have EST Cartels in Large size. I run a size 12 boot (i think) and i have mine set in a similar fashion to avoid toe/heel overhang.
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Old 09-02-2014, 03:21 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Thanks.

Just figured it might be helpful, 'cause I know I would be pissed to have to find out the hard way if I had a size 10 boot, and bought the Cartels in Large...
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Old 09-03-2014, 04:05 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I'm have 10.5US Deeluxe ID boot in Cartel large binding, on the bottom of the 3 holes on the disc as well and boots are centered perfectly. Riding a Never Summer SL 161. Will post photos once I get home.
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Old 09-03-2014, 04:18 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Found them...

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Old 09-03-2014, 11:31 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OU812 View Post
I'm have 10.5US Deeluxe ID boot in Cartel large binding, on the bottom of the 3 holes on the disc as well and boots are centered perfectly. Riding a Never Summer SL 161. Will post photos once I get home.
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Originally Posted by OU812 View Post
Found them...

Hmmm.... The main thing that jumps out at me is that US10.5 Deeluxe ID boot looks about the same size as a ThirtyTwo Lashed in US13..! Wow.

Well, pics don't lie, so apparently, depending on your boot's footprint, Burton's binding sizing is either way off (w/ a smaller/reduced footprint boot), OR, not so bad after all (w/ a chunkier boot that has a larger footprint).
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Old 09-03-2014, 11:44 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CK1000 View Post
Hmmm.... The main thing that jumps out at me is that US10.5 Deeluxe ID boot looks about the same size as a ThirtyTwo Lashed in US13..! Wow.

Well, pics don't lie, so apparently, depending on your boot's footprint, Burton's binding sizing is either way off (w/ a smaller/reduced footprint boot), OR, not so bad after all (w/ a chunkier boot that has a larger footprint).
Yeah that really surprised me as well. I wore a bulkier size 12 last year but when I switched to an 11.5 lashed this year I'm no longer able to get centered on all my boards.

Anyone have any experience with medium cartels with a larger boot size?
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Old 09-03-2014, 05:18 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Dude, I dunno. I have limited experience. Its my first pair of bindings, first pair of boots but second board. Originally I had a Lib Tech TRS that I returned for warrantee because the bindings holes were drilled crooked. Lib and store were cool about it, but local distributor took too long to get a new board. Asked for money back and bought SL, like it a lot more actually. Boots centred on the TRS as well. *shrugs*

I'm thinking of buying the Nike Kaiju boots for this season but now I might hold off if I'll have problems with them not fitting the bindings properly but from what I've asked and heard I should be using Large bindings. Even Union when I emailed them told me L/XL.
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Old 09-03-2014, 06:37 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OU812 View Post
Dude, I dunno. I have limited experience. Its my first pair of bindings, first pair of boots but second board. Originally I had a Lib Tech TRS that I returned for warrantee because the bindings holes were drilled crooked. Lib and store were cool about it, but local distributor took too long to get a new board. Asked for money back and bought SL, like it a lot more actually. Boots centred on the TRS as well. *shrugs*

I'm thinking of buying the Nike Kaiju boots for this season but now I might hold off if I'll have problems with them not fitting the bindings properly but from what I've asked and heard I should be using Large bindings. Even Union when I emailed them told me L/XL.
Just read some reviews on Deeluxe boots and sounds like they definitely have a larger footprint, which explains why you haven't had any issues. According to another thread I found they run almost a full size larger than average, where boots with footprint reduction run a size smaller. I can almost guarantee you will run heel heavy with Kaijus in your size.

Burton recommends large bindings for sizes 10+, but the entire point of this thread is that's just not accurate. Union is a different company making a different product so not sure how that's relevant. Besides most Union bindings have an adjustable heel cup so getting your boots centered on the board is just not an issue.
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Old 09-03-2014, 07:57 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brewtown View Post
Just read some reviews on Deeluxe boots and sounds like they definitely have a larger footprint, which explains why you haven't had any issues. According to another thread I found they run almost a full size larger than average, where boots with footprint reduction run a size smaller. I can almost guarantee you will run heel heavy with Kaijus in your size.

Burton recommends large bindings for sizes 10+, but the entire point of this thread is that's just not accurate. Union is a different company making a different product so not sure how that's relevant. Besides most Union bindings have an adjustable heel cup so getting your boots centered on the board is just not an issue.
Yeah pretty much...

Just seems like "times-are-a-changin'" and most of the boot companies have moved to where the "reduced footprint" thing is now commonplace (it's like the new "normal").

For me, as a bigger dude with size 13's, it's great because good mid-wide boards are everywhere now and it works out great 'cause I don't have to ride a 27+cm wide truck.

That said, for the peeps in that 10+ to 12ish range (and there's a lot of youz) Burton's sizing can be totally off... Think it's safe to say that if you're in that range and have a smaller-footprint boot, bet on the Mediums working out, check first if you can...
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