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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 01:43 PM Thread Starter
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Union force or Cartel Restricted Reflex

Hi,

I have a question.I hope I get some help from you. I drive the Union force 2011, should I get to the Cartel Restricted 2012 or should I stay with Union? Any Opinions or experience?

I ride 50% park and rails and 50% all mount.

Thx.

Alex

Last edited by Alex1; 12-19-2011 at 01:48 PM.
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 02:04 PM
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Force's over cartels any day of the week.
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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 02:27 PM
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If your Forces are doing their job and aren't falling apart keep em' put $230 towards lift tickets instead of bindings. I just bought the new Union Forces can't ride them till after xmas ( gift from my gf ) but they seem sick. Cartles also seem awesome all about prefrence but don't buy unless you need it just remember this years $230 model will be like $180 this summer.

Last edited by civic2tegg; 12-20-2011 at 12:29 PM.
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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 02:56 PM Thread Starter
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Hm, I thought that the new Cartels 2012 are much better, because of the Reflex and so on? If not, Iīd keep the Forceīs. Some People a writing they are so much better this year. The asym-strap, no foward lean ....



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Originally Posted by civic2tegg View Post
If your Cartels are doing their job and aren't falling apart keep em' put $230 towards lift tickets instead of bindings. I just bought the new Union Forces can't ride them till after xmas ( gift from my gf ) but they seem sick. Cartles also seem awesome all about prefrence but don't buy unless you need it just remember this years $230 model will be like $180 this summer.
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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 08:39 PM
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Burton over Union in general.

Especially Cartels over Forces. Better ankle strap, better dampening, better toestrap, a highback you can actually push on in a turn... Forces are... Trendy?

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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 10:41 PM
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I have the 2012 Forces and would not recommend them. These are the issues I've had after 2 days riding.

1. Weird toe cap. Topic beaten to death in another thread.
2. "Grippy" ratchets. It's not really an issue and to me it's fine, but the ratchets are not as silky smooth as others have mentioned.
3. Straight out-of-the box, the side piece of the binding that allows heel depth adjustment was stripped where the nut goes. So basically the nut was spinning with the screw which made it impossible to remove. My LBS had to drill out the screw but that doesn't fix the problem because the binding side was stripped. They replaced the whole binding for me.
4. First day riding the toe cap comes off. The screw holding it came off and didn't notice.
5. Second day riding the ankle strap came off. The screw holding it also came off but thankfully I did find that screw piece.

I put some Loctite on the screws after the second day, but wasn't expecting them to crap out so soon. They aren't "bad" bindings and I do like them, but after my experience I will go with another brand for my next pair.
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 01:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowrax View Post
I have the 2012 Forces and would not recommend them. These are the issues I've had after 2 days riding.

1. Weird toe cap. Topic beaten to death in another thread.
2. "Grippy" ratchets. It's not really an issue and to me it's fine, but the ratchets are not as silky smooth as others have mentioned.
3. Straight out-of-the box, the side piece of the binding that allows heel depth adjustment was stripped where the nut goes. So basically the nut was spinning with the screw which made it impossible to remove. My LBS had to drill out the screw but that doesn't fix the problem because the binding side was stripped. They replaced the whole binding for me.
4. First day riding the toe cap comes off. The screw holding it came off and didn't notice.
5. Second day riding the ankle strap came off. The screw holding it also came off but thankfully I did find that screw piece.

I put some Loctite on the screws after the second day, but wasn't expecting them to crap out so soon. They aren't "bad" bindings and I do like them, but after my experience I will go with another brand for my next pair.
In a rare defense of Union here, besides the stripping (which is a factory issue, not really Unions fault) this all sounds like your fault. Did you tighten everything before you rode? If you didn't that all could have happened to any binding. If you did tighten everything down its a whole different thing, and more Unions fault.

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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 02:56 AM Thread Starter
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So, ok and what about the Union Atlas vs Cartels 2012? But I think Iīll sell my Union and will get the cartels
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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 07:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYinfamous2k2 View Post
Force's over cartels any day of the week.
Have you tried the 2012 Restricted Cartels?

Re:Flex... Autocant... Living Hinge adjustment... Superb ratchets on both the ankle and toe straps... asym ankle strap... Toe caps are eh for me, but way better than Union's IMHO.

What Union has over Burtons though is durability. DuPont Zytel plastics and lifetime warranty on baseplates. Bomb proof.

If you go with Union, I highly suggest you take your boots into the shop and make sure that toe strap fits properly. Or just pick up a pair of Ride ThinGrip straps and Frankenstein them.

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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 08:12 AM Thread Starter
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I had no chance to test the Cartels. Iīll get them today, if I donīt like them I can sent them back. So which one would you choose, the Unionīs or the Cartels?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo View Post
Have you tried the 2012 Restricted Cartels?

Re:Flex... Autocant... Living Hinge adjustment... Superb ratchets on both the ankle and toe straps... asym ankle strap... Toe caps are eh for me, but way better than Union's IMHO.

What Union has over Burtons though is durability. DuPont Zytel plastics and lifetime warranty on baseplates. Bomb proof.

If you go with Union, I highly suggest you take your boots into the shop and make sure that toe strap fits properly. Or just pick up a pair of Ride ThinGrip straps and Frankenstein them.

Last edited by Alex1; 12-20-2011 at 08:14 AM.
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