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Malavitas or Union Forces?

17K views 120 replies 28 participants last post by  snowklinger 
#1 ·
Some I've decided to get an Ultrafear for this season. I was wondering which bindings you guys would recommend to pair with this board? I have Cartels on my Horrorscope. I have tried Union Contact Pros, but I want to try some new bindings.
 
#49 ·
Wired will come up with a lot of great suggestions. I'd also like to throw in the GNU carbon credit. I put in around 25 days last season (my first season as well) and the board handled everything I threw at it, pow/slush/and ESPECIALLY ice. I enjoyed it a lot.
if you have only been riding for two seasons what makes you think you have enough experience to give people advice on snowboarding?
 
#58 ·
How is two seasons of riding not enough time to form a valid opinion?

What super-OG-core-bro-"I'll be on misty 2014 shit by this Christmas" cred do you have? Does it make your opinion more accurate or your riding level and preferences more in line with a person's who's asking advice?

I live in the PNW. I'm well over six feet tall, and have a big foot. I ride a fair amount of powder, some backcountry/sidecountry steeps and technical stuff, like to charge, and at the ski area I fuck around on the small and medium jump lines in the park and am always on the lookout for side hits. I feel that I might have an insight into related categories of gear, but would be less able to inform somebody about jib boards or hardboot-style race boards. Even the opinions on gear that I know well are still just subjective impressions and anecdotes. I try to qualify that. If you don't, then you're just being a domineering, self-important asshat.
 
#57 · (Edited)
you're kinda thick. i don't need overall product knowledge to state the fact that my toe strap can be easily released. i just need a hand and a set of eyes.

please go away.

PS. sorry you think say fuck you to me after I helped you setup your bindings is a good decision. It's actions like this that cause noobs to get ignored, or bad advice. Next time stay on EL and ask them how to setup your bindings and if your board is to wide.
you think i'm going to lick your feet because you KINDA helped me? just don't butt in next time.
 
#74 · (Edited)
you're kinda thick. i don't need overall product knowledge to state the fact that my toe strap can be easily released. i just need a hand and a set of eyes.

please go away.



you think i'm going to lick your feet because you KINDA helped me? just don't butt in next time.
I'd really perfer you didn't and don't want anything from you even if you do. Personally I thought the wierd stuf was the Germans, not the Sweeds. My point is: you bought an incorrectly sized board for your foot size, you don't know how to mount bindings, you bought bindings that you like and you bought boots that are not naturally shaped to work with your bindings highback causing an ill fit. I don't understand what makes you have any knowledge to drop about snowboarding in general, or bindings you've never ridden.
 
#60 · (Edited)
Crazed...

I say put the cartels on your ultra, and maybe take a look at the Union Atlas. The atlas is a bit softer and has more lateral flex than the Force and will be able to work on your softer horror, and, if you love them, will be equally at home on your ultrafear.

You can then use your cartels (If you're building a quiver) on a stiffer board. If you weren't into your contact pros though, because of the toe buckle, go Malavitas, that's a good one two punch if you're planning on staying burton.


Sorry you're having to wade through all of this silliness, especially shredlife, who, I honestly have no idea what he does on these forums except follow people around who may like Unions and say "I DON'T LIKE THEM!! ARRRRGHHHH"

Kung Martin don't let these guys rile you up, but don't take their opinion lightly...some of these dudes have been riding Unions for HOURS, BRO!
 
#64 ·
I've been around snowboarding for almost 27 years. There are people who have been riding for two years who have MUCH more experience with certain gear than I do. I respect their experiences and opinions as valid. I don't, however, take ANYONE'S opinion as being authoritative.

Generally, the more emotional comments (ie: X brand sucks!) that are associated with an opinion, the less I consider it when forming my own.

I know too many people who rip on gear that would absolutely not work for me to ever think that there are universal truths about this shit. Any attempt by some blowhard to make themselves appear to be an authority on matters of subjective opinion just makes them look like an asshole. Blind advocacy or opposition is ridiculous. 90% rider, 10% board (and other gear). Ride what you like.
 
#62 ·
Don't be hypocritical EL guys.

Let me tell you that I did a brief review of the Forces that I demoed at the 2011 Test Fest. In that review, I specifically stated my negative tone had more to do with the countless Union fanboys that used to destroy threads in this very forum. Yes, I was annoyed by this forum's users.

I gave my honest opinion about my experience and fully disclosed that they were pre-production at a demo event. So what happened after that? Johan came in and basically bashed me. He made real snooty remarks like I was hating on Union as a company.

But you won't see his remarks because he deleted that account and made one under his EL name.

Let me add that when I requested catalog info on union bindings via my work, which started carrying Unions, he made a comment asking if I'm "The Leo Shim who hates all things Union." This was on my work email. I post on here in my spare time. Yet, he chose to bring up his silly beef in our work email exchange.

So don't come in these forums acting altruistic. You guys are being hypocritical especially considering how you talk about us in that EL thread. Don't talk about how you care about snowboarding and think this bickering and fanboyism is trash when some of you EL members trashed me for posting about products on EL a while back. Admittedly though, a lot more of you were cool with me than not.

My point is, this forum or that forum, same shit goes on. I intended to keep my mouth shut, but this is getting ridiculous. If Johan truly wanted to be constructive and not just hate on SBF, he would have tossed those Team bindings to a "misinformed" or "uneducated" member here to have them give Union a legitimate try.

So don't kid anyone. You guys aren't here to help. You're here to be condescending hypocrites.

And please, don't go snitching me out to my employer for this post or have any of your cronies talk shit to me at test fest as I walk by.
 
#65 ·
I am not a fanboy. In the interest of full disclosure, this is what I posted on EL in regards to why I decided to be more active on SBF:

" I just don't like people being asshats to each other in a way that makes enjoying snowboarding more difficult. We all know how difficult it can be to find solid info and get a set-up that you trust, fits you well, and lets you concentrate on the IMPORTANT part of the 90/10 aspect of riding. Being told by an "expert" that the ONLY way to approach buying gear is to buy EXACTLY what they tell you to get - regardless of your budget or personal preferences. Fuck that!

The pretentious "experienced rider as gatekeeper to the sport" thing is just so much bullshit, too. I volunteer my time and money for organizations like the service board and the chill foundation trying to get kids into snowboarding and keep them stoked on a free, open, inclusive community of riders who just want to have fun and share the outdoors. The "core" douchers ruin all that, and fuck with kids who are already apprehensive about trying to be "cool" even though they can't buy all the raddest brands, and they're still working on linking their turns or making it smoothly to the far side of the butter box. I HATE that shit.

When an obviously young, inexperienced rider wants to know whether they should buy the t. rice or the custom flying v, it's not time to belittle their question or steer them towards your pet brand. It's an opportunity to help a kid find a board that they're gonna be stoked on and learn to do their first ollie on. That's the board that will begin to define what a pow turn is. They'll make regretful sticker choices, and they'll be crushed when it first starts to get dinged up in the lift lines. How do the Nivek and ShredLife tools not remember what that is like?"
 
#63 · (Edited)
If you've been riding the equipment in question two years longer than the other person who seems to have an opinion on it, based on hours of writing. The other person is an authority on nothing, and is the source of the opinion and shit other people have told you/read on teh webz.

Do you have a binding suggestion? I'm tired of asking you this question in every thread.

Edit: Leo, I respect your (and Dave's) opinion around here, and if you weren't feeling unions, you weren't feeling them. You also have explained why, clearly, and with disclosure. You are, unfortunately, an exception to the rule. It's not altruism, and I have said such in other threads. It's that, for some reason, a very vocal group around here, with no qualifications/limited experience with the product on the shelves being asked about, feel the need to say nonconstructive, and silly things whenever this product is asked about.

When someone, who HAS ridden the product and knows more about it, disagrees, they chime in again, with the same lack of experience with the product in question but a bunch of INSANE ramblings about their snowboarding stripes. Which don't mean shit, if it isn't about what the poster is asking. All people are asking for here, is for those people to respectfully disagree and move on.
 
#73 ·
I don't mean to paint a broad stroke. Some guys here are obviously being destructive. So is Johan with this dumbass contest.

For eff sakes. I completely stopped talking about Union after our email exchange. I continued to just focus on other products not getting involved in Union based threads. I did this even after his cronies were being little dick headed smart asses behind my back while I was at a demo event for y employer.

Now he has this contest going and putting up the front that he wants you guys to educate SBF members. Instead, this whole thing is causing uneccesary beef and bad blood. Want to know what's worse than the people you claim to be gatekeepers here? Two Internet forums full of snowboarders beefing with one another over one fucking snowboard brand and acting like one forum is better than the other.

You want to talk about caring for the sport and riders? Then don't contribute to this ignorance.

Whatever. No such thing as bad press I guess.
 
#76 ·
Leo, honestly, I have NOTHING but respect for you because you did what most people would do in that situation. Turn the fucking page. Not look at every page where it's mentioned and attempt to hijack the thread with opinions that are passed off as fact (to people who apparently aren't even allowed to have an opinion if they've been riding for fewer than two years).

All I'm asking is, people like you and Dave continue to set the example you're setting and help people who have questions about gear. I will do the same. Letting this vocal group shout down stuff with limited experience is silly and turns this place into clown shoes.

Or, in Nivek's case, barbie shoes.
 
#77 ·
if you don't have the 90% yet your opinion on the 10% doesn't really matter.

i'll get at least 80-100 days this year - the equivalent of your life's experience.



Arcteryx - sorry little buddy but you're just showing your ignorance here. if you're into your fashionista thing and like to buy new outerwear every season or two that's on you. i like shit that works and lasts. Arcteryx makes hands down the most effective outerwear in the game. better than any snowboarding company because all of them are marketing to little teeny-bopper hipster-wannabes who are sponsored by mommy. name one. say AK and i'll laugh in your face.
 
#82 ·
Is any of this aimed at me?

I'm not the one who started riding two years ago. I started riding almost 27 years ago. There were some breaks in there, and I may not have a lifestyle that allows me to ride more than a couple of days a week, but I get my days in. I'm not going pro or anything, but I'm happy with my 90%.

Arcteryx doesn't make "hands down" anything (except maybe one of the most expensive options on the market). They make seam-welded gore-tex outerwear. So do a bunch of other companies. Same fabrics. Same laminates. For my money, the jackets have a fit that's too short in the body, and the pants have cuffs that are a little snog to comfortably get over my boots. If they work for you, that's great. I have a few different pieces of outerwear, but I'm really liking the stuff from Airblaster and Volcom lately. they fit my tall frame, and the price and construction are in line with what works best for me. I ride primarily in the PNW, so waterproofing and breathability are a big deal.

Is this the part where your opinion enables you to belittle mine?
 
#80 ·
I just don't get why Johan's panties are this bunched up. Doesn't he realize that he is losing customers here. Love or hate this forum, but just like at EL, people buy gear based on what they read here.

I can't imagine how awesome Johan could have made Union look had he chose to give those Team bindings to someone here... not a reviewer, but someone looking to decide between a Union or say a Malavita.

That would have been respect right there. Instead, potential Union customers are now seeing people from two different forums arguing with each other because of a contest Johan, a Union employee, decided to run.

Matty, you're trying to be reasonable right? Am I way off base here with what I said?

You want to see awesome marketing and use of forums like these? Pay attention to Never Summer, Rome, and even Wired Sports. Look at the loyalty they receive and just how many of their products are being bought based off how they treat members here.

That could have easily been Union with Johan. Maybe he's just too core to do the same. But then again, isn't that why he hates SBF members? Because we think we're too core?
 
#84 ·
This wasn't a "forum raid", at all. Although the Pointer Sisters may say otherwise.

Johan's whole rationale for this "contest" was to encourage members from EL who are either pro-Union or have had solid, positive experiences on their bindings to come to SBF to provide an opposite viewpoint to the vocal minority that is vehemently against C3.

Phony doesn't want the Teams. I don't want the Teams. I'm sure matty doesn't either. I couldn't give a fuck less about that contest. The reason why we're here is because we enjoy talking about snowboarding with other people.

Do you even know who Johan is?
He is an integral part of the community over at EL, along with numerous other industry people. He posts in threads, bullshits, and has personal relationships with a bunch of posters there. Much like WiredSport and whatever other guys you have here. That's awesome marketing. I even think he took some ELers feedback and input them into last year's Superpros.

Anyway, anyone who wants to talk snowboarding is more than welcome over at Easyloungin.
 
#83 ·
Leon,

I don't think Nose hates anyone on snowboarding forum, but he has noticed, that there are a few people on here that spit misinformation all over the place to people that are actually interested in the products he's selling.

Leo, you did the right thing, you didn't like the products, had an e-fight (maybe?) and were like, well I'm going to spread the stoke about stuff I do like. I didn't like Union, but I have other things to sell.

You didn't have anything nice to say, so you didn't say anything at all.

Two people on this very thread, one of which hasn't contributed ANYTHING to the thread, go OUT of their way, to shoot down every Union post based on very limited experiences, or outdated ones.

Again, you, Dave, SnowWolf climbz, are people around here I respect.

Nivek, I just can't take seriously anymore, especially when it comes to Union stuff.
I have no idea what Shredlife does except follow me and Nivek.
 
#86 ·
no that diatribe was to your little buddies.

they do not use the same face fabrics. period. the sabre line and more of the newer stuff is cut more with an "on resort/i never have to wear a harness or a backpack" kind of a look.

volcom's gore is nothing like Arc' everything from V has liners: pointless in a gore hardshell. they're also sub-par construction compared to Arc' - hell even Mt. Hardware is...

airblaster??? :laugh::laugh::laugh: come on dude.


if all you do is ride resorts and you buy or get kicked new gear every year or two then i can see why you're fine with it.

when/if you start riding backcountry, camping in the snow in tents or in snowcaves, hiking for lines, and living in your gear you will realize what i'm talking about.
Trew, HomeSchool (sorta), AK (sub-par construction to Arc') LINERLESS shells are about the only thing coming close to a 'snowboard' company trying to compete with Arc'
 
#92 ·
I only know Johan from his rude comments in my Union force review. To the point where even mocked me in his forum signature in this forum. I returned the favor.

The thing is, as I pointed out, he crossed the line when he brought this up in my work email. This is my personal account. Yes, I had a signature with my employer's site before, but with a disclosure that I don't represent the company. Johan on the other hand DOES represent Union.

We supposedly squashed our silly beef in that email exchange. Only to have smart ass remarks made at me at the following test fest.

Does any of this honestly sound cool to you? Am I going up to the Union tent and bringing up some Internet beef between me and Johan? Am I talking shit about him behind his back at test fest? No.

While he might be the coolest broseph at EL, he sure wasn't here.

And like I said, I call BS on his contest intent. But regardless of that intent, the end result is the same. There's now a bunch of trash talking between EL and SBF members.

Not a very effective way of educating riders if you ask me.
 
#94 · (Edited)
Leo and Dave,

Leo, sorry, you had a bad experience, I don't know him personally, but I think at the tent he was just taking the piss out of you.

I have to disagree with the contest intent. So far, the only results of this contest, have (when not presented with "resistance" from a very small group of people) been positive. A lot of members who needed help setting up bindings, buying boots, boards, etc. were helped by more active members on EL. All while staying on topic...the only people who have veered things off topic have been the more active members of this board. You can look, aside from making fun and throwing a dubious eye on skichalletshack I have been on topic in every thread I've posted in. I can't say the same for some members who had to be constantly reminded to contribute to the thread instead of making attacks.

Which reminds me... Shredlife, which bindings do you prefer?
 
#97 ·
Leo and Dave,

So far, the only results of this contest, ... have (when not presented with "resistance" from a very small group of people) been positive.
Yeah this is nothing against you (thanks for being mature about everything) and you're right it has not been all bad and certainly there are members on this forum who have played right in to their hand , but what i'm saying is that this was a predictable outcome of the "contest" (which has now been mysteriously disappeared from EL).
 

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#110 ·
I love Reading this forum to learn stuff (pros and cons) about all the manufacturers because I don't personally get to try all the gear I want too. Personally it seems more open minded here towards brands (although certain people do like to voice their disliked brands) than EL does. Generally on here you get a vast lineup of good choices with the few heavily favorited brands and every time I read an EL thread it seems like its always the exact same shit being pushed and heavily pro union for bindings and hating a majority of other brands. Atleast that was the feel I had when I searched things there.

Since the start of that ridicules "contest" it's made reading this forum fucking suck and a headache to see any actual real information in between the bickering and hating.
Hopefully it looks like it is finally starting to turn back in a positive direction. Hell even shredlife was constructive there for a second lol.
 
#111 · (Edited)
I love Reading this forum to learn stuff (pros and cons) about all the manufacturers because I don't personally get to try all the gear I want too. Personally it seems more open minded here towards brands (although certain people do like to voice their disliked brands) than EL does. Generally on here you get a vast lineup of good choices with the few heavily favorited brands and every time I read an EL thread it seems like its always the exact same shit being pushed and heavily pro union for bindings and hating a majority of other brands. Atleast that was the feel I had when I searched things there.
How long did you lurk over on Easyloungin?

EL is heavily pro C3, and there are a few die hard fanatics over there, but even they annoy me with their blind, irrational love for a single product. But there are a ton of guys over there, with a lot of knowledge about many, many different brands who are more than willing to drop some information if you ask.

Personally, what you wrote about SBF is exactly how I feel about EL. There's a lot of Analog, Airblaster, C3, and Burton love over there, but there are many posters who ride other things and like I said, are more than willing to help out other people with their experiences.

This place isn't bad at all, other than a couple kooks who think they're "King of the Mountain" on an internet site. Tools.
And that's the thing, you said you like reading all the "pros and cons" of a single brand. Every single fucking brand is going to have pros and cons, it depends on you personally as a rider and your preferences for things. However, due to a couple people being too clueless to correctly set up a pair of Union bindings, even if it took them 2 hours, and then come and just blatantly spam SBF with the "cons" of a certain brand, is there a reason why people can't post up their positive experiences with product, without the Pointer Sisters freaking out and ripping their hair out?

There's even people filtering over to EL from here who are mentioning the random anti-C3 hate.

"Mainly here for the simple fact that I was beginning to think I was a dumbshit for rocking Force when I haven't ever had a problem with them. Start to read stuff long enough though and it can make a guy think twice.

Feeling much better about my 2nd Union purchase after lurking the forums here for the past few days."

There's a place for every single snowboard company out there, and obviously C3 is killing it, due to their market share and product flying off the shelves. If they don't work for you, go find something else.
 
#112 ·
This.

Especially the part that newer members and less experienced members of this forum are constantly being dictated to by a few guys who, while knowledgeable (I think), bristle at the fact that an opinion/experience can differ from theirs and refuse to defer even when they don't have as much experience with the product as someone else.

It takes a lot of credibility away from them and the forum itself, which is, by and large, a cool place. Shouts to Leo and Dave.
 
#113 ·
It was around the time I joined here I was reading around EL also. Still do from time to time when I can't find what I'm looking for here. I'm sure there are a knowledgable guys there also. May have just been the majority of what was being talked about on EL are brands I'm just not interested in styling/design wise, not saying its bad product and they like the brands I do here. I like Ride and there seems to be nothing for hate about them every time I look on EL.

I think guys around here like Leo, Dave z, snowwolf (great detailed reviews), and Nivek (I know he dislikes mervin and union, but he has great knowledge about a lot of other brands) give great views on equipment. There is a very diverse group here IMO and I think generally you get a lot of pros and cons for every brand. Bios is probably more in one direction here and EL in the other direction, but you still hear the good about everything.
 
#115 ·
Well your just one heck of an agreeable person aren't you? First you agree with that rep for needing to get this started. Now you agree with snow wolf that everyone needs to get over it (I do however also agree)... If there were a list of people to blame for this shitfest that has taken place over the last few day you would be right under that rep who started it all.

Okay I'm done now. This is annoying and I don't know why I just decided to get involved. Maybe it was the annoyance of it all, maybe it was boredom.
 
#116 ·
To the OP, in my opinion go with the tivas.

Some people clearly love union bindings and clearly the toe caps fit their boots, good for them.

Many people (not just the haters) find the straps don't fit well. I have seen many people make that same observation here in Japan as well as on this forum.

Just seems weird to an impartial like me that a company wouldn't try to address a clear issue raised by many customers.

Its like the response from union is "No you're wrong, the toe cap is perfect you just don't know how to use it right, we'll keep on making it the same way until you realize how to use it right".

Opinions are very subjective, everyone knows that.

Even though some members on here are very (way over the top) vocal in their preferences or dislike of certain brands those reading take it with a pinch of salt.

Anyone with any sense listens to pros and cons from a range of people then makes their OWN choice.

Its just gear, why shouldn't we be able to say what we think?

If its good gear there will be plenty of positive posts to balance the negative ones. Thats the point of a forum as opposed to a review site where people need to keep good relations with the companies.

Nivek is pretty vocal in his dislike for NS, fair enough, he prefers other boards.

Doesn't stop those who like NS recommending them on here. Let everyone have their say.

Its not the negative or positive opinions on gear that are the problem.
Its emotional, personal attacks that I would like to see the end of.

Just makes reading through a thread a pain in the ass and much longer than it needs to be:thumbsdown:.
 
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