Supra

Way to over generalize there! What are these marketing materials? Last time I checked the burton site it says the cartels are " a shade more powerful than the malavitas". The reps would be the one that Nivek spoke to? Or have you personally spoken to one? And the reviews......nivek again?

If you read my posts more carefully you would have seen that I'm not disagreeing that the cartel highback is not as stiff as the vitas, I'm saying that the 2013 cartels do not have less support than the 2012's. the vita baseplate is softer than the cartel one though.

I think nivek is just comparing the 2013 cartel and vita highbacks rather than 2012 to 2013 cartels

The-Snoopy

Great with some info guys, but if you would give me your opinion regarding which binding to go for to :-D ?

Should i try to grab some older cartels ? last year or 11 ?..

/Cheers

Supra

Get them in this order depending on your budget:
2014 ltd or 2013 regional love
2013
2011 late release with reflex
2012

Just make sure you get a pair with reflex bases

BFBF

To answer your initial question as I sift through the BS advice and attempt to summarize from my burton bindings over the years:

- I've had 3 different cartels over the years including year one with the crazy forward lean.---- Cartel will be solid middle of the road bomb proof all mountain binding... Tried and true performer

- I own generation one diodes that i've had for a few seasons( I got a sample a few years ago before they were released)--- Don't worry about breaking them, i'm 6'1 185 and have them on My rossignol Experience and they look brand new. - Lightweight and extremely aggressive. Much more responsive than the cartels. Stiff highback, geared toward freeride, but you can use ANY binding anywhere...If this sounds like your style =diodes.

krankedmusic

I got the cartels est on my Sherlock beautiful set of bindings. Had flows 3 & 5 Broke the base plate on both, volkl broke the strap lock. Had the cartels for 2 years now. Only bindings that had lasted this long.

poutanen

Get a pair of Burton C60's end of story... There are several brand new pairs still available from the 2011 stock IIRC. If not I'll be selling my T7 and C60s when I'm fully comfortable with my new board.

They'd be a great match for a Custom X.

Lamps

That's exactly what I would do.

Nivek

Bahahaha. 3%. Manufacturing tolerances are more than that jack stack. One of the dudes I work with has last years Malavitas and this years Cartels. They're softer. He said so. He owns both. He's been riding for 20ish years. I had a wwhole discussion with the head rep out here about it. How he's tired of them changing the Cartel literally every single year. That he wished they take a year off on it and let it be.

I'll believe they're the same stiffness only after the designer himself talks to me.

This is the internets. Without anything to back it up I might as well just say Jake told them too soften them up cause he wanted them a bit more playful.

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Supra

so, you're not speaking from first-hand experience, just from what a buddy told you, eh. He says the 2013 cartels are softer than the 2012 malavitas, right? How does that prove anything? You can't conclude that the cartels have been getting softer every year.
Anyways, you're right about the internet. Luckily, I don't have to convince you of anything.

Nivek

Here, I'll compare them all. 2012 Cartel is stiffer than 2012 Malavita. 2012 Malavita is the same as 2013 Malavita. Thereby the 2012 Cartel is stiffer than the 2013 Malavita. 2012 Cartel is stiffer than 2013 Cartel.

Same Glass content in the base between the Cartel and the Malavita. The trays are the same on the ReFlex, and the biggest difference between the EST's is the Hinge. Which does not make the binding less responsive.

2012 and 2013 Cartels have the same frame for both EST and Reflex. The strap is different for the standard, but the Restricted for 2012 and 2013 is the Asym.

Where then is the difference? The highback. Its softer torsionally. That matters. It makes the binding softer. 3% is a number you made up. No respectable engineer will claim that as a legitimate stat for something with low realistic manufacturing tolerances.

__________________
Snowboarding Sucks.