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Old 01-03-2014, 02:04 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Question Edge tuning woes

Hey guys,

Tuning newbie here. I have a pretty new Burton Custom Flying-V. I took it out once so far, but it was pretty rocky and my edge got a lot of burs. I picked up a Dakine side edge filer, since conditions are still pretty icy in Tahoe and I wanted to keep the edges nice and sharp.

Problem with this sport that I'm finding is that there is an unusual amount of conflicting information, whether it's on YouTube, forums, or even professional websites. For all mountain, some sites say keep the whole edge sharp, some say detune contact areas, other sites say only detune nose/tail PAST contact areas, etc. Which is it?

At one point I stupidly took a couple passes with the wet pocket stone (some site said to do it) and I believe that I detuned my whole heel edge... Or it was like that just from wear, but that was only a single day. Anyway, I took a LOT of passes with the 90 deg Dakine edge tool, and despite how much material I scraped off, I was never able to make it as sharp as toe-side (using the finger nail test). Is this normal? I've ordered a better edge tool with multiple diamond stones, as afterwards I read that this is what I really want if I'm aiming for sharpness (vs changing angles w/ the file).

The other concern that I have is that I think that I took A LOT of material off of that side edge. I was cleaning up the dust on my work table and had to brush off quite a bit. The edge itself looks fine, but it made me wonder: "how much filing can an edge take over the lifetime of the board?". Any insight would be appreciated.

Help this newbie out! Thanks in advance.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:27 PM   #2 (permalink)
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[QUOTE=Teslatic;1396017]Hey guys,

Tuning newbie here.

For all mountain, some sites say keep the whole edge sharp, some say detune contact areas, other sites say only detune nose/tail PAST contact areas, etc. Which is it?

These are all essentially saying the same thing. Your effective edge essentially does end at the contact points. Keep it sharp to those points. Dull it slightly thereafter so there isn't an off chance of the tips catching.

At one point I stupidly took a couple passes with the wet pocket stone (some site said to do it) and I believe that I detuned my whole heel edge...

Yes you probably did. Now you need to resharpen it.

Anyway, I took a LOT of passes with the 90 deg Dakine edge tool, and despite how much material I scraped off, I was never able to make it as sharp as toe-side (using the finger nail test). Is this normal? I've ordered a better edge tool with multiple diamond stones, as afterwards I read that this is what I really want if I'm aiming for sharpness (vs changing angles w/ the file).

Two different routines and tools used for different reasons. You need a file to actually cut a fresh edge on the board. If you "polish"it once a week thereafter with the diamond stones it will help keep the edge sharper.


The other concern that I have is that I think that I took A LOT of material off of that side edge. I was cleaning up the dust on my work table and had to brush off quite a bit. The edge itself looks fine, but it made me wonder: "how much filing can an edge take over the lifetime of the board?"

You don't need to take a lot of edge off. But you need a good large file holder to keep the edge angle consistent. Just pull the tool "toward you" in short strokes. If the two edges don't feel same its probably the inability of the tiny pocket tool to keep a consistent angle.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:28 PM   #3 (permalink)
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You are gonna get a lot of advice, but I like the "Ski Visions Ski Sharp Edge Tuning Tool". It's hard to wreck your edges with this tool. I rarely use the file. The NS boards have no bevel, so I set both settings at 0 degrees, and the stones do a great job of cleaning up and sharpening both edges. I keep the camber zones sharp, but it's personal preference on detuning the contact areas. I don't sharpen the tip/tail contact areas, just polish any burrs off. My only complaint with the stones is that they require frequent cleaning because they are small.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:34 PM   #4 (permalink)
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there is lots of personal preferences including bevel angles (base and side)
http://www.racewax.com/t-edge-tuning.aspx

the detuning past the contact areas is to reduce the liklihood of catching the edges and wiping out... usually good for noobie boaders...

down to preferences.

the file on the edge tuners is there to quickly remove material, but it leaves some its own small burrs and rough finish.

THis is where a say, using diamond stones comes in handy to polish (has to be a wet polish) base and side edges to be nice and sharp.

I use:
http://www.racewax.com/p-375-base-si...nd-stones.aspx

Are there better guides to buy? Of course, if you want to dish out the money

Burton grinds their edges to be 1 base bevel and 89 edge bevel (so it's at 1 setting on my base/edge tuning tool)

Last edited by tanscrazydaisy; 01-03-2014 at 02:42 PM.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:56 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psi-Man View Post
The NS boards have no bevel
I don't think that's right dude. NS boards come out of the factory with a 0.5 deg base bevel and 1 deg side bevel. I emailed them to ask when I bought my Proto and that was their response. I don't mean to get all HKTRDR on you, just thought the point should be clarified.
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:13 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardasacatshead View Post
I don't think that's right dude. NS boards come out of the factory with a 0.5 deg base bevel and 1 deg side bevel. I emailed them to ask when I bought my Proto and that was their response. I don't mean to get all HKTRDR on you, just thought the point should be clarified.
No worries, sorry for the blanket statement. I was referring to my older F1, which is most definitely 0/0. I wasn't aware that NS was messing with this now. Bevels/Beveling, now that's a whole other discussion.
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:35 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tanscrazydaisy View Post
there is lots of personal preferences including bevel angles (base and side)
Edge Tuning for Skis and Snowboards

the detuning past the contact areas is to reduce the liklihood of catching the edges and wiping out... usually good for noobie boaders...

down to preferences.

the file on the edge tuners is there to quickly remove material, but it leaves some its own small burrs and rough finish.

THis is where a say, using diamond stones comes in handy to polish (has to be a wet polish) base and side edges to be nice and sharp.

I use:
Base-Side Bevel File Guide SKS Multi Tool with 3 DMT diamond stones

Are there better guides to buy? Of course, if you want to dish out the money

Burton grinds their edges to be 1 base bevel and 89 edge bevel (so it's at 1 setting on my base/edge tuning tool)
Thanks for this post and all the others, guys. I had no idea that burton has that settings by default. Good to know once my new edger comes in (w/ three stones). That probably explains why I was losing so much material at 90 deg.

Again, should I be at all concerned with removing too much material for those few 50-100 strokes that I probably put into that edge? Or is it probably fine? Should I be able to return it to a sharp 1 deg/89 deg (apparent Burton default)? Really just looking for piece of mind here guys.
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:38 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hardasacatshead View Post
I don't think that's right dude. NS boards come out of the factory with a 0.5 deg base bevel and 1 deg side bevel. I emailed them to ask when I bought my Proto and that was their response. I don't mean to get all HKTRDR on you, just thought the point should be clarified.
Up until this year they have been 0/0 from everything I've read and seen. This year, supposedly a few boards are coming from the factory with different bevels, and from what I heard it was .5/.5.

Isn't a 0.5 base and 1 side going to be a little more acute than a 0/0 or 1/1?
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Old 01-03-2014, 06:23 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Teslatic View Post
Thanks for this post and all the others, guys. I had no idea that burton has that settings by default. Good to know once my new edger comes in (w/ three stones). That probably explains why I was losing so much material at 90 deg.

Again, should I be at all concerned with removing too much material for those few 50-100 strokes that I probably put into that edge? Or is it probably fine? Should I be able to return it to a sharp 1 deg/89 deg (apparent Burton default)? Really just looking for piece of mind here guys.
If you ride in tahoe take it to Tahoe Dave's and either get them to tune it one time for you and learn from them, or just straight up ask their advice, I'm sure they'll help you. They are good people and do a good job...

Ski and Snowboard Tuning and Repair Services
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Old 01-03-2014, 08:21 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teslatic View Post
Hey guys,

Tuning newbie here. I have a pretty new Burton Custom Flying-V. I took it out once so far, but it was pretty rocky and my edge got a lot of burs. I picked up a Dakine side edge filer, since conditions are still pretty icy in Tahoe and I wanted to keep the edges nice and sharp.

Problem with this sport that I'm finding is that there is an unusual amount of conflicting information, whether it's on YouTube, forums, or even professional websites. For all mountain, some sites say keep the whole edge sharp, some say detune contact areas, other sites say only detune nose/tail PAST contact areas, etc. Which is it?

At one point I stupidly took a couple passes with the wet pocket stone (some site said to do it) and I believe that I detuned my whole heel edge... Or it was like that just from wear, but that was only a single day. Anyway, I took a LOT of passes with the 90 deg Dakine edge tool, and despite how much material I scraped off, I was never able to make it as sharp as toe-side (using the finger nail test). Is this normal? I've ordered a better edge tool with multiple diamond stones, as afterwards I read that this is what I really want if I'm aiming for sharpness (vs changing angles w/ the file).

The other concern that I have is that I think that I took A LOT of material off of that side edge. I was cleaning up the dust on my work table and had to brush off quite a bit. The edge itself looks fine, but it made me wonder: "how much filing can an edge take over the lifetime of the board?". Any insight would be appreciated.

Help this newbie out! Thanks in advance.
You're right that if you go bananas with files and such you can use up your edge.

A single day of icy conditions can dull your edge so it could be that it got dulled on its own.

Anyways, an easy thing for beginner sharpeners to do is get a diamond stone or two for deburring when you hit some rocks. You learn a big about your edges as you smooth those spots back out, but it's hard to really mess things up with them:

Personally I believe that the various snowboarding edge tools are cheap plastic junk from china and that if you are going to sharpen yourself you should get a proper tool like this and a file to go with it:

Swix Wax and Swix Tuning Supplies at SwixShop.com: Swix Side Edge File Guide 2'

Read this guide:

Tuning - The Carver's Almanac

Best one I've found.

For your current situation, you've screwed up, take your board to a good shop and get your edges done. Explain your situation. It sounds totally fixable to me. They'll get you back where you belong and you can maintain from there.

There are many good sharpening videos on YouTube. A frequent tip is to paint the edge with a marker and then only file till the marker is gone. I do this myself.
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