Bataleon 2012 Q & A - Page 2 - Snowboarding Forum

phile00 · 02-03-2011, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nivek

ETs a just a bit stiffer in the tips than an Evo. More well rounded.

Also, the Whatever was one of the most fun boards I have ridden.

Damn you even got to demo some bataleon boards? What exactly is the target of the whatever? Do you know it's specs? Care to give a review?

Wiredsport · 02-03-2011, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phile00

What exactly is the target of the whatever? Do you know it's specs? Care to give a review?

Bataleon Whatever 2012

Shape: Freestyle TBT, Outline Shape: Twin, Flex Pattern: Twin, Flex Rating: 7/10, Setback: None

Biax Laminate, Extruded, 20 inserts, Lightning Edge, "Core" Core.

Whatever the Conditions, Whatever the Terrain...you get it. This is designed to be a one board quiver for the New Bataleon rider.

Nivek · 02-03-2011, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wiredsport

Bataleon Whatever 2012

Shape: Freestyle TBT, Outline Shape: Twin, Flex Pattern: Twin, Flex Rating: 7/10, Setback: None

Biax Laminate, Extruded, 20 inserts, Lightning Edge, "Core" Core.

Whatever the Conditions, Whatever the Terrain...you get it. This is designed to be a one board quiver for the New Bataleon rider.

I did not feel as though it was a 7. Felt more like a 5.

Anywho, review will come here if angrysnowboarder.com doesn't need it. Later rather than sooner I'd guess. Not a big deal since you can't buy one till August anyways.

Just know that it is in my top 5 favorite most fun snowboards I have ridden.

Wiredsport · 02-03-2011, 08:28 PM

[QUOTE=Nivek;370057]I did not feel as though it was a 7. Felt more like a 5.
QUOTE]

From our blog:

Trying to get an accurate idea of how a specific board will flex in comparison to others? Watch out! There is more marketing misinformation and straight out nonsense published about flexibility than about most other elements of snowboard fit. Finding the correct flex (stiffness and feel) is crucial, but it won't be found in a single number printed on a fit chart.

Let's clear one thing up straight off. There is no industry standard for flex. That is to say, what one company considers a "4" has no direct relation to another company's "4" or "Medium Soft", or "Less Harsh". That's correct, boards that carry the same number may (and usually do) have an entirely different feel.

OK, so that makes it tricky to compare one brand to another, but what about within a brand? Even here, big problems exist. Most brands are still putting a single flex rating on an entire model. That is to say, this year's Travis White pro model gets a flex rating of "2", but what? It's rated a 2 in both 149 cm and in 163 cm? Hey now, the chart says that those two sizes are rated for riders separated by 70 lbs, how can the flex rating be the same? Wait, you say, they are rating the overall flex of the model so it could be compared to other models of the same brand of a similar size. The problem there is that board designer’s change the flex of each model at different size breaks to achieve the feel that they are after for that specific model. In other words, the difference in flex between a 149 and a 154 in one model may be far greater than the flex difference between those same sizes in another model. Additionally, many times a rider will be deciding between two sizes of the same model. Does the 157 really have the same flex as the 159? If so, why are the weight ratings for those sizes so different?

The biggest confusing factor, however, comes from the improvements in flex control technologies that have evolved over the past decade. A board that is designed to have a buttery soft tip and tail with a firm mid section flexes far differently than a constant flex board designed for a similar rider size. It is not that it is necessarily more or less flexible, but that the flex characteristics are entirely different. To get around this issue, certain companies have switched from a flex rating to a feel rating. This is a step from bad to worse. There is simply no way to compare these complex relationships in a single number or term. It would be equal to comparing a tangerine to a pineapple using a fruitiness scale, rated 1 to 10.

What is the answer? The only way to figure out the flex component is to dig deeper. Getting the info on the core weight range that a model and size were developed for and understanding the flex characteristic of that model is the only way to get the correct flex for your needs.

Nivek · 02-03-2011, 09:10 PM

I get all that, I've been riding for quite some time and sell this snowboard stuff. I'm not new to the nuances of snowboards.

No, you can't compare numbers between companies. An experienced rider can compare in a companies line. They call their stiffest boards 7's. So to call the Whatever a 7 to me just seems wrong. It is not near the stiffness of a Jam or Undisputed.

It felt to me just shy of mid-stiff for a park board in a 153 and I weigh 145. So in that case to say that it ranks with the stiffest of the rest of the Bataleon line just doesn't add up.

BurtonAvenger · 02-03-2011, 09:25 PM

Numerical values are a crock of shit and completely made up with no quantifiable test with results to back it up.

Wiredsport · 02-03-2011, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BurtonAvenger

Numerical values are a crock of shit and completely made up with no quantifiable test with results to back it up.

That is the Cliff Notes version

Biornus · 02-03-2011, 11:28 PM

I'm 6'1 tall, weight 80 kg and have a US12 size boot. I am riding a Goliath 161W, and LOVING it!

I would like to get a more freestyleboard for next year, at least a lot shorter one, to make rotations etc. easier. I've heard the Whatever as a suggestion, would you have any other ideas?

Wiredsport · 02-03-2011, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biornus

I'm 6'1 tall, weight 80 kg and have a US12 size boot. I am riding a Goliath 161W, and LOVING it!

I would like to get a more freestyleboard for next year, at least a lot shorter one, to make rotations etc. easier. I've heard the Whatever as a suggestion, would you have any other ideas?

Evil Twin 156 Wide. Poke those 1080's

Goliath/ET - That is like a Bataleon Dream pack.

Biornus · 02-03-2011, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wiredsport

Evil Twin 156 Wide. Poke those 1080's

Goliath/ET - That is like a Bataleon Dream pack.

They've made a wide!? OMBBQ!

02-03-2011, 08:28 PM	#14 (permalink)
Wiredsport -LIFETIME MEMBER- Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,784	[QUOTE=Nivek;370057]I did not feel as though it was a 7. Felt more like a 5. QUOTE] From our blog: Trying to get an accurate idea of how a specific board will flex in comparison to others? Watch out! There is more marketing misinformation and straight out nonsense published about flexibility than about most other elements of snowboard fit. Finding the correct flex (stiffness and feel) is crucial, but it won't be found in a single number printed on a fit chart. Let's clear one thing up straight off. There is no industry standard for flex. That is to say, what one company considers a "4" has no direct relation to another company's "4" or "Medium Soft", or "Less Harsh". That's correct, boards that carry the same number may (and usually do) have an entirely different feel. OK, so that makes it tricky to compare one brand to another, but what about within a brand? Even here, big problems exist. Most brands are still putting a single flex rating on an entire model. That is to say, this year's Travis White pro model gets a flex rating of "2", but what? It's rated a 2 in both 149 cm and in 163 cm? Hey now, the chart says that those two sizes are rated for riders separated by 70 lbs, how can the flex rating be the same? Wait, you say, they are rating the overall flex of the model so it could be compared to other models of the same brand of a similar size. The problem there is that board designer’s change the flex of each model at different size breaks to achieve the feel that they are after for that specific model. In other words, the difference in flex between a 149 and a 154 in one model may be far greater than the flex difference between those same sizes in another model. Additionally, many times a rider will be deciding between two sizes of the same model. Does the 157 really have the same flex as the 159? If so, why are the weight ratings for those sizes so different? The biggest confusing factor, however, comes from the improvements in flex control technologies that have evolved over the past decade. A board that is designed to have a buttery soft tip and tail with a firm mid section flexes far differently than a constant flex board designed for a similar rider size. It is not that it is necessarily more or less flexible, but that the flex characteristics are entirely different. To get around this issue, certain companies have switched from a flex rating to a feel rating. This is a step from bad to worse. There is simply no way to compare these complex relationships in a single number or term. It would be equal to comparing a tangerine to a pineapple using a fruitiness scale, rated 1 to 10. What is the answer? The only way to figure out the flex component is to dig deeper. Getting the info on the core weight range that a model and size were developed for and understanding the flex characteristic of that model is the only way to get the correct flex for your needs. __________________ Gnu \| Rome \| Bataleon \| Flow \| Electric \| Roxy \| Arbor \| Flux \| Dragon \| Neff http://www.wiredsport.com/?snow http://www.wiredsport.com/blog/

02-03-2011, 09:10 PM	#15 (permalink)
Nivek Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mountains of Mordor Posts: 5,373	I get all that, I've been riding for quite some time and sell this snowboard stuff. I'm not new to the nuances of snowboards. No, you can't compare numbers between companies. An experienced rider can compare in a companies line. They call their stiffest boards 7's. So to call the Whatever a 7 to me just seems wrong. It is not near the stiffness of a Jam or Undisputed. It felt to me just shy of mid-stiff for a park board in a 153 and I weigh 145. So in that case to say that it ranks with the stiffest of the rest of the Bataleon line just doesn't add up. __________________ Snowboarding Sucks.

02-03-2011, 09:25 PM	#16 (permalink)
BurtonAvenger Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Mountains Posts: 8,052	Numerical values are a crock of shit and completely made up with no quantifiable test with results to back it up. __________________ Angry Snowboarder Because someone has to call it how they see it!

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02-03-2011, 11:28 PM	#18 (permalink)
Biornus Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Revelstoke, BC Posts: 80	I'm 6'1 tall, weight 80 kg and have a US12 size boot. I am riding a Goliath 161W, and LOVING it! I would like to get a more freestyleboard for next year, at least a lot shorter one, to make rotations etc. easier. I've heard the Whatever as a suggestion, would you have any other ideas?