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Old 09-08-2012, 04:23 PM   #1 (permalink)
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So my friend asked me this yesterday but being that I am still a relatively new rider, about to go into my second season , I am not terribly sure on the answer so I am turning to you guys. Anyway question is since he is a heavier guy, not fat, how much flex would he need as a beginner who has never gone before. He weighs 245-255 and he is 6'2". He wants a board thats easy to learn on so one would assume a softer board but being his weight/height what flex would be soft without being a complete noodle?

Also like I said he isnt fat he just lifts a lot and he is trying big as possible so he is an athletic guy so i dont know if his lower body strength will change the flex he needs either...see where I was a bit confused haha anyway any help would be awesome
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Old 09-08-2012, 05:40 PM   #2 (permalink)
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That big..... Stiff
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Old 09-08-2012, 07:56 PM   #3 (permalink)
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That big..... Stiff
All of this, especially if his weight is muscle. That means he has more strength to manipulate the board. Expect to spend more than normal for beginner gear. Stiffer = more expensive
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Old 09-09-2012, 03:13 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Tell captain beefcake that he should temper his weight accomplishments with some sort of distance be it swimming, biking, running or hiking.

Otherwise being like that is good for weighlifting and cruising the gay bars thats about it.
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Old 09-09-2012, 10:19 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Hi Bandit,

Cool of you to get your friend some good info before he gets started. The premise that he needs a softer board should be dropped for now. As a big guy and a new rider having a stiffer board that resists distortion will help him greatly. Let us all know his foot size and we will make some specific suggestions.

Some info on Flex ratings (and why to ignore them).

Trying to get an accurate idea of how a specific board will flex in comparison to others? Watch out! There is more marketing misinformation and straight out nonsense published about flexibility than about most other elements of snowboard fit. Finding the correct flex (stiffness and feel) is crucial, but it won't be found in a single number printed on a fit chart. Let's clear one thing up straight off. There is no industry standard for flex. That is to say, what one company considers a "4" has no direct relation to another company's "4" or "Medium Soft", or "Less Harsh". That's correct, boards that carry the same number may (and usually do) have an entirely different feel. OK, so that makes it tricky to compare one brand to another, but what about within a brand? Even here, big problems exist. Most brands are still putting a single flex rating on an entire model. That is to say, this year's Travis White pro model gets a flex rating of "2", but what? It's rated a 2 in both 149 cm and in 163 cm? Hey now, the chart says that those two sizes are rated for riders separated by 70 lbs, how can the flex rating be the same? Wait, you say, they are rating the overall flex of the model so it could be compared to other models of the same brand of a similar size. The problem there is that board designer's change the flex of each model at different size breaks to achieve the feel that they are after for that specific model. In other words, the difference in flex between a 149 and a 154 in one model may be far greater than the flex difference between those same sizes in another model. Additionally, many times a rider will be deciding between two sizes of the same model. Does the 157 really have the same flex as the 159? If so, why are the weight ratings for those sizes so different? The biggest confusing factor, however, comes from the improvements in flex control technologies that have evolved over the past decade. A board that is designed to have a buttery soft tip and tail with a firm mid section flexes far differently than a constant flex board designed for a similar rider size. It is not that it is necessarily more or less flexible, but that the flex characteristics are entirely different. To get around this issue, certain companies have switched from a flex rating to a feel rating. This is a step from bad to worse. There is simply no way to compare these complex relationships in a single number or term. It would be equal to comparing a tangerine to a pineapple using a fruitiness scale, rated 1 to 10. What is the answer? The only way to figure out the flex component is to dig deeper. Getting the info on the core weight range that a model and size were developed for and understanding the flex characteristic of that model is the only way to get the correct flex for your needs.
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Old 09-09-2012, 11:31 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiredsport View Post
Hi Bandit,

Cool of you to get your friend some good info before he gets started. The premise that he needs a softer board should be dropped for now. As a big guy and a new rider having a stiffer board that resists distortion will help him greatly. Let us all know his foot size and we will make some specific suggestions.
.[/B]
His shoe size is an 11-11.5 depending on the boot and thank you for the flex info it was very informative. Since we brought up boot size a waist width of around 251-254/255 is what he should be looking for right?
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Old 09-09-2012, 11:51 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Got it. There are a lot of board choices that will work well. The Bataleon Goliath 163 Wide will be a great closeout option:
Bataleon Goliath 2012 Snowboard - Bataleon Snowboards and Gear - Brands

In answer to your waist question, "waist" width is a best avoided in trying to determine width. Even so, the widths that you mentioned are too small for his foot size as reported.

Some more info:

How wide of a snowboard do I need? Where is the width of a snowboard measured? What does width mean in terms of my boot size?

Letís start by talking about measurements, because this is where a lot of the confusion arises. The most common width measurement that is provided by manufacturers is "waist". The waist is measured at the narrowest point near the middle of the board (usually). But like with all things in snowboarding, different brands measure different things. Some measure the midpoint between the tip and tail and call that "waist". Others simply provide a measurement they call, "width", but do not really specify what width they are referring to.

If that has you a bit confused, don't worry, because regardless of where these "waist" measurements are taken, they are not very useful for what they are typically used for. Most people think that this measurement is a good indicator of what foot size a board will handle. It is not, and for a simple reason: you do not stand at the waist, you stand at the inserts. A board's waist measurement is always less than the measurement at the inserts and often the difference is significant. Additionally, two boards with the same waist dimension, may have very different measurements at the inserts, depending on each board's sidecut. Measurement at the center insert is a much better way to compare boards for shoe size compatibility, but for some odd reason, manufacturers do not publish this info.

OK, so now we have told you why we think the commonly provided measurements are pretty silly, but what good does that do you? You still need to know how to figure out the correct width for your new board. Well, here comes. There are two easy steps to getting it right every time.

First, measure your bare foot. It is important that you do not try to use a boot size. It is also important that you measure in centimeters, because the board measurements that you will be comparing to will be in cm. Here is the method that we suggest:

Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters).

Second, measure the board you are considering. This measurement is easy. It should be taken at the inserts. Try to measure at the inserts that you will be using to achieve your stance position. If you are unsure about this, simply measure at the center of the insert cluster (that will still be very close). Be sure to measure using the base of the board, not the deck. This is important because the sidewalls on many boards are angled in, and will therefore give you a smaller measurement on the deck than on the base. For our example's sake, let's say the measurement is 27.54 at the center insert.

Still with us? You are almost done. You now have a way to compare foot size to board width where it matters, but how do you interpret this info to get the correct width? Well that depends a little on stance angle. If you ride a 0 degree stance, you will want your foot size to be the same as the width of the board at the inserts or up to 1 cm greater. If you ride at an angled stance, you will want to measure the board across at the angles that you will be riding. Again, you will want your foot to at least match this measurement or exceed it by up to 1 cm. So using our example above, this guy has a foot 28.57 cm that exceeds the board with at the inserts 27.54 cm by 1.03 cm at a zero degree angle. But, when he angles his feet to the 15 degree angles that he rides, voila, he has .10 cm of overhang for a perfect fit.

But wait a second. Are we saying that you should have overhang, even with bare feet? Yes. You will need overhang to be able to apply leverage to your edges and to get the most out of your board. 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch of boot overhang for both toe and heel is ideal, and will not create problematic toe or heel drag. Remember that boots typically add 1/2 at both the toe and heel to your foot measurement from above, due to padding, insulation and the outer boot materials. We do not suggest using the boot length to size boards though, as the extra padding etc, cannot be used well to create leverage, that has to come from your foot itself. We highly recommend that riders do not choose boards where their feet do not come to or exceed the real board width.

OK, that's all well and good, but where can you get the information on board width at the inserts if the manufacturers don't provide it? That's easy. Email the store that carries the board(s) that you are considering. Give them your foot length in cm (and your stance width and angles if you know them). They will be able to provide you with the width at the inserts that you will be using and can factor in your stance angle as well to get you the exact overhang that you will have with bare feet.

PS:

Once mounted, the best way to test is to put your (tightly laced) boots into your bindings and strap them in tightly. It is important that you have the heel pulled all the way back into the bindings heel cup or the test wonít help. On a carpeted floor place your board flat on its base. Kneel behind the heelside edge and lift that edge so that it rests on your knees and so that the toeside edge is angled down into the carpet. Now press down with both hands using firm pressure, one hand on each of the boots. This will compress the board's sidecut and simulate a turn on hard snow. You can change the angle of the board on your knees to become progressively steeper and you will be able to see at what angle you will start getting toe drag. You will want to repeat the test for your heelside as well. If you are not getting drag at normal turn and landing angles, then you are good to go.

PPS:

Also a note about boots: Boot design plays a big role in toe drag as does binding ramping and binding base height. Boots that have a solid bevel at the toe/heel drag less. Many freestyle boots push for more surface contact and reduce bevel. This helps with contact, but if you have a lot of overhang with those boots it hurts in terms of toe drag.

Now go ride!
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Old 09-09-2012, 12:20 PM   #8 (permalink)
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That does seem like a more effective method, only problem is that where we're from in the Midwest we only have one board shop that literally carries like seven burton boards at a time. Seriously only burton and two of them are women's boards so he doesn't really have the option to measure at the inserts but maybe that info can be found online i don't recall whether or not most specs have the width at the inserts or not. I suppose he could order a board he is considering and if its not wide enough he can send it back, kind of a hassle but might be what he has to do. And that is a good price for that bataleon I will pass on the recommendation. He is mostly looking to get into free riding on and off piste so he is gonna need a board more suited toward that as well a he has absolutely no desire to go into the park
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Old 09-09-2012, 12:25 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by snowklinger View Post
Tell captain beefcake that he should temper his weight accomplishments with some sort of distance be it swimming, biking, running or hiking.

Otherwise being like that is good for weighlifting and cruising the gay bars thats about it.
I will let him know lol but he actually hikes bikes and rock climbs with me as well...funny nonetheless
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Old 09-09-2012, 12:33 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Ya thats not really stupid big for 6'2-3. At least if he does those things he will be less prone to injury with snowboarding - shoot the weights don't hurt either as long as he stays limber.
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