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14K views 68 replies 10 participants last post by  Basti 
#1 ·
Hey guys, so I'm going to buy new gear for this season. I've been riding for one season, progressing fairly fast, and now that I've got some money in my pocket I felt like it was time to get my own stuff instead of hiring!

The thing is, I'm not 100% on what to buy. I've looked into TBT and it sounds really awesome, even though I've never ridden it it sounds like my kind of board.
I'd say that I'm an all-mountain rider, focusing on pow and park. I haven't ridden a lot of park yet, but I'm going to spend a lot more time there this season since it's great fun! I want a mid-soft board that you can jib around, doing butters and what not, but one that doesn't get unstable in pow or in the pist.

The ones I have looked into is the Lobster Park Board 2013, Lobster Freestyle Board and the Bataleon Airobic 2013. I did look into the Bataleon GW, but it's a bit more expensive than the other ones and I'm not sure if it's worth the extra money. Would be great to get your opinion on this!

I am also going to buy a new pair of bindings. I haven't looked into any specific ones, but I have heard good things about Union, Flux and Switchback so that's what I'm thinking about getting. As with the board, I want an all-mountain binding that's nice to ride on on the whole mountain. I don't really know if I should get a soft or a stiff binding, since I've never owned one before.
Sorry for the long post (and the bad English), but any help on the matter would be very appreciated!:)
 
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#2 ·
I'm in a similar boat to you. I've pretty much settled on the Parkboard 2013 with Eiki's Switchbacks. Still looking for boots and the rest of my gear though!

From what I've learned so far, boots are the most important piece of your equipment, and you need something with the perfect fit for you, so make sure you take a look at some of the new releases and old favorites.
 
#3 ·
Hi guys,

Stoked to see that you are both getting ramped up this year with your first setups! That is when the fun starts and your progression can go into overdrive.

There is a lot of advice given about what component is the most important: board, boots or bindings. In truth, your gear is only as good as the weakest component. A great board and boots on poor bindings, for instance, are going to come down to the level of the bindings. This does not mean high priced components, just ones that are well designed for your style, well built, well adjusted, and that are a perfect fit for you.

You will get some great advice here. If you could both post up your weights and foot sizes we will all get you some suggestions.

STOKED!
 
#4 ·
Wow, your post just put a big big smile on my face!:) Nice to see some cool people around here!
I do realize the importance of having good boots. The reason I didn't mention them in the first post is because boots are so personal that it's hard to give any advice on what boot would be good on my foot.

I weigh about 176-180 lbs, I'm about 6' tall, and I have a size 9.5 on my shoes. The thing about my feet though, are that they're not 9.5s in length, but i need to use that size since I have quite wide feet. The length of my feet are more like 9s, but I guess that doesn't make much of a difference.

Refer to my first post as to what kind of a board and bindings (and boots) I'm looking for! Thanks a lot to everyone that will give advice and help me with this:)
 
#7 ·
Surpisingly, it does make a big difference. All of your foot dimensions will be useful for getting the right size boot but only the length of you foot will help with board sizing. For that reason we suggest that you use foot size not boot size when searching for a deck.

Please measure your foot using this method:

Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters).

Thanks again!
My feet are according to that method 25 cm long!

Nice hijack of my thread Edge:D
 
#11 ·
My feet are according to that method 25 cm long!

Nice hijack of my thread Edge:D
That's cool, you guys are both US size 7 (based on length only).



Size 7 is the forgotten size by almost all board companies. You guys are both going to benefit from looking at boards that are very narrow. Even those will be technically too wide for you but that will be as close as we can get.
 
#12 ·
I have posted this here alot but I think it might be helpful:

How wide of a snowboard do I need? Where is the width of a snowboard measured? What does width mean in terms of my boot size?

Let’s start by talking about measurements, because this is where a lot of the confusion arises. The most common width measurement that is provided by manufacturers is "waist". The waist is measured at the narrowest point near the middle of the board (usually). But like with all things in snowboarding, different brands measure different things. Some measure the midpoint between the tip and tail and call that "waist". Others simply provide a measurement they call, "width", but do not really specify what width they are referring to.

If that has you a bit confused, don't worry, because regardless of where these "waist" measurements are taken, they are not very useful for what they are typically used for. Most people think that this measurement is a good indicator of what foot size a board will handle. It is not, and for a simple reason: you do not stand at the waist, you stand at the inserts. A board's waist measurement is always less than the measurement at the inserts and often the difference is significant. Additionally, two boards with the same waist dimension, may have very different measurements at the inserts, depending on each board's sidecut. Measurement at the center insert is a much better way to compare boards for shoe size compatibility, but for some odd reason, manufacturers do not publish this info.

OK, so now we have told you why we think the commonly provided measurements are pretty silly, but what good does that do you? You still need to know how to figure out the correct width for your new board. Well, here comes. There are two easy steps to getting it right every time.

First, measure your bare foot. It is important that you do not try to use a boot size. It is also important that you measure in centimeters, because the board measurements that you will be comparing to will be in cm. Here is the method that we suggest:

Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters).

Second, measure the board you are considering. This measurement is easy. It should be taken at the inserts. Try to measure at the inserts that you will be using to achieve your stance position. If you are unsure about this, simply measure at the center of the insert cluster (that will still be very close). Be sure to measure using the base of the board, not the deck. This is important because the sidewalls on many boards are angled in, and will therefore give you a smaller measurement on the deck than on the base. For our example's sake, let's say the measurement is 27.54 at the center insert.

Still with us? You are almost done. You now have a way to compare foot size to board width where it matters, but how do you interpret this info to get the correct width? Well that depends a little on stance angle. If you ride a 0 degree stance, you will want your foot size to be the same as the width of the board at the inserts or up to 1 cm greater. If you ride at an angled stance, you will want to measure the board across at the angles that you will be riding. Again, you will want your foot to at least match this measurement or exceed it by up to 1 cm. So using our example above, this guy has a foot 28.57 cm that exceeds the board with at the inserts 27.54 cm by 1.03 cm at a zero degree angle. But, when he angles his feet to the 15 degree angles that he rides, voila, he has .10 cm of overhang for a perfect fit.

But wait a second. Are we saying that you should have overhang, even with bare feet? Yes. You will need overhang to be able to apply leverage to your edges and to get the most out of your board. 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch of boot overhang for both toe and heel is ideal, and will not create problematic toe or heel drag. Remember that boots typically add 1/2 at both the toe and heel to your foot measurement from above, due to padding, insulation and the outer boot materials. We do not suggest using the boot length to size boards though, as the extra padding etc, cannot be used well to create leverage, that has to come from your foot itself. We highly recommend that riders do not choose boards where their feet do not come to or exceed the real board width.

OK, that's all well and good, but where can you get the information on board width at the inserts if the manufacturers don't provide it? That's easy. Email the store that carries the board(s) that you are considering. Give them your foot length in cm (and your stance width and angles if you know them). They will be able to provide you with the width at the inserts that you will be using and can factor in your stance angle as well to get you the exact overhang that you will have with bare feet.

PS:

Once mounted, the best way to test is to put your (tightly laced) boots into your bindings and strap them in tightly. It is important that you have the heel pulled all the way back into the bindings heel cup or the test won’t help. On a carpeted floor place your board flat on its base. Kneel behind the heelside edge and lift that edge so that it rests on your knees and so that the toeside edge is angled down into the carpet. Now press down with both hands using firm pressure, one hand on each of the boots. This will compress the board's sidecut and simulate a turn on hard snow. You can change the angle of the board on your knees to become progressively steeper and you will be able to see at what angle you will start getting toe drag. You will want to repeat the test for your heelside as well. If you are not getting drag at normal turn and landing angles, then you are good to go.

PPS:

Also a note about boots: Boot design plays a big role in toe drag as does binding ramping and binding base height. Boots that have a solid bevel at the toe/heel drag less. Many freestyle boots push for more surface contact and reduce bevel. This helps with contact, but if you have a lot of overhang with those boots it hurts in terms of toe drag.

Now go ride!
 
#13 ·
With that said, decks such as the Lib TRS are produced in Narrow.

In 148 it is 1.4 cm less wide at the inserts than the Parkboard. With some stance adjustment and perfect binding positioning/tweaking you will get very close to the ideal on one of these narrow decks.

I hate to be the one to tell you that you should not go with a model that you had your heart set on.
 
#14 ·
Thanks for the reply Wiredsport, a lot of useful information there.

I've been using a UK size 7 (US 8) in the past, and for hired boots they fit reasonably well. Do you have any recommendations for park-oriented boards that are fairly narrow and would fit well with a US 8?
 
#16 ·
Hi Edge, as i mentioned above (unfortunately) the boot size that you choose is not the focus here. It is your foot length. Boot length will not help with leverage.

Skate Banana comes in narrow and is very fun in the park.
 
#25 ·
That is a good suggetsion, brother, and in honesty it will be as good for Neliz as the TBT boards with a possible advantage from Magnetraction and ass pickle (which tends to help get a heelside edge).

But, the big problem we have still remains. All of these boards are wider than Neliz's feet are long (by quite a bit). Snowolf, you are in a more fortunate position as size 8.5 is on the smaller side of "Normal" (yeah, I hate using that word) so you have an extra 1.5 cm to deal with. To hammer how big a difference that is, 1 cm is typically the difference between a normal and wide snowboard.

For full sized riders (170-180 lbs) that have size 7, they really fall outside of the intended rider range for all of the boards that are typically discussed here.
I applaud Mervin for doing Narrow models but they limit them to very small board sizes which helped out Edge in this thread but leaves Neliz hanging.
 
#26 · (Edited)
Ah gotcha on that. What kind of width are we needing again? I can also check my NS spec sheets to see if something in our line might be doable....:thumbsup:

EDIT: I see you mentioned the narrow skate nana, did you mention the TRS Slims? if he wants some camber that has the C2 I believe....
Yessir, We had talked a bit about the TRS earlier in this thread. Great minds thin...nah. :) The only issue there is that 151 is the largest size for the TRS in Narrow (shame). That is going to be too small for this rider for anything other than pure play...and that would not be the board I would suggest for that.

Dude, it might be a really valuable resource to put together a sticky thread of best choices for guys with small feet. It might also prompt some manufacturers to step up and build (more) narrow models for this range.
 
#27 ·
Okay, let's see if I got this straight.
So my feet are to small for the "normal" size/width of boards, but my weight is to big for me to be able to ride the smaller but narrower boards?

I haven't really looked at any other boards but the TBT ones, i.e. Lobster and Bataleon. The reason for this is because from what I have read, it sounds really awesome. I'm basically only riding in Scandinavia, in the Alps and I might be going to Japan. I don't really know anything about the snow conditions there, but would those places be a problem for the TBT?

So what you're saying is that I shouldn't be going for a Bataleon/Lobster board?:(
 
#28 · (Edited)
Hi,

That is basically all correct.

180 lbs is over the weight range that will work well on the narrow boards which max out at 151 cm.

I am unaware of any models in popular boards that are technically a "fit" for a good all purpose deck for your size 7 feet in the sizes that are required for 180 lbs.

The Alps will make this even harder as the conditions are often hardpack/ice. This typically favors going a bit stiffer and a bit longer in terms of effective edge.

When your feet are inside the confines of the board's edges you end up not having the leverage that is available to riders who are at, or just outside of the edges.

Personally I would suggest that you get a board with some form of Magnetraction, Grip Tech, etc. This will get you the most out of the leverage that you do have and will help you bite into the hardpack that you will often be riding.

Apologies if this sounds like bad news but these are the choices that we have to choose from.
 
#31 ·
Okay, I think I understand the whole problem.
I'm just going to ask again though, and if you could give me a detailed answer I'd be a very happy Swede!
Does the gap between my feet and the edges, that OK fit as you put it, make such a big impact on my riding that going for a Bataleon board would be a really bad move. Like if I, as a newbie, got a narrower board from another manufacturer I would feel a big differrence in how it rides?

I looked at the Gnu Park Pickle and it sounds like a cool board, although it does seem like it is a little stiff. I would prefer to ride on a mid-soft board if that's a reasonable and possible choice. Not really keen on the Pickle's graphics either.
 
#30 · (Edited)
neliz...I resemble your condition....I'm 5'6", 22" 15/12 duck stance, right at 180 and size 7 boot on a good day...actually just got 32 focus boas in a women 7.5 for a bit of a snugger fit when packed out...last 2 years been using 32 focus boas in women 8. We are outside the standard deviation.

So my remedies have been stiffer pro women's boards
Option Trinity 158 (old 2005) cambered directional fr stiffy, Option Kendra Starr 155 (2005? cambered fs twin abit softer), Gnu B-nice (cambered twin with mag....?2008...it was a definitely softer flex) The problem with these boards was lack of stance width. I also have an Option 162 northshore cambered shovel nose pintail, 159 skate banana, 164 charlie slasher...these have been ridable but very cumbersome to get on edge...however my remedy wass to use riser plates...I made some diy 20mm plates and this made edge to edge response much more doable. The b-nice was very fun for goofing groomers but I snapped the tail and the skate banana was sold because it was too cumbersome and folded up too much in the pow if you got alittle too tail/nose heavy...otherwise I still have the above boards to ride depending on conditions.

Recommendations for narrower boards: Gnu B-pro 155...demo'd for a day and it is a fun board and has great response...I would have bought one except for two things...I already have enough inbounds groomer and pow boards so I bought a 159 gnu billygoat split to get into baker slack/bc...it is narrower than the trs and t-rice and rider choice. The other board I gave serious thought about was Snowolf's suggestion of a ass park pickle. Another thought is to check out venture boards and have them lay one up to your specs.
 
#32 ·
you will have less ability to get on edge with a wider board. So it will impact you. You turn in snowboarding using your edges so anything that lessens the response will make turning harder.

Will it be impossible, no. Will it be much more difficult, yes.
it sounds like you have your heart set on a bataleon, i think you might want to look at the womens boards like another guy suggested, a stiff womens board will ride like soft park board at your weight, you will have to look at thinks like set back etc. but with feet as small as you have options are limited.

I have the opposite problem, I wear 12.5's which is another forgotten size and I use wide boards, my options are limited every year. I know there are companies you can call that will put their other boards graphics on a different deck (usually there is a charge)...see snowolfs NS pandora/summit for more details :p I cant recall if it is the summit or a different one, sorry for any mix up snowolf.
 
#33 ·
Hi Neliz,

Yes, this makes a huge difference in riding. You can read here how carefully users consider whether to go wide or normal. That difference is typically 1 cm or less. You are talking about falling 2 cm short of the ideal.

I would suggest a narrow Magnetraction board over TBT.
 
#34 ·
You bloody poufta wanker......:cheeky4:

J/K

Seriously though, what is nug tech? Maybe I'm living under a rock but I have never heard that term.
I guess the tech is actually called RADuction or something. Its from Burton, shown in the Burton Nug, but they actually have like 3-5 boards based on this, including, all mountain boards, a split, and a swallowtail . The general idea is that these boards ride 10cm shorter than typical weight/length standards. Its generally flamed as novelty bullshit, its kind of like unwearable fashion, but I thought this would be a spot where it COULD be relevant.
 
#37 · (Edited)
I have dealt with this problem for 9 seasons and have demo'd a fair amt of women's boards, every year talk to and demo the mervin lib/gnu/roxy boards and talk to them about doing up a narrow men's board...but to no avail...however they are getting abit narrower compared to the past years. If you want performance of quick edge to edge and snappy performance (screw the graphics...i don't care...i want performance)...the best option imho is a top of the line stiffest and largest women's board you can find...because even though its rated as stiff it will be a noodle to medium flex for a guy. Btw I've demo'd ns infinity, solomon lush & gyspy, current gnu b-nice, recent arbor push, roxy envy and they were too noodlie. Another thought iirc is perhaps an old atomic hatchet and captia bsod were narrower boards. Just from my experience, I've stay away from the triple base tech is because I need great edge engagement without having to over-commit-to-get-on-edge from a body mechanics/position point of view. Another thing is with women's boards is that you don't need the rocker or even c2btx...and my preference is for a cambered (assuming ur riding groomed and packed pow)...because of your/my weight you press out any camber...however the c2btx is fun cause you can turn on a dime without having to unweight/suck-up/cross-under turns (however I like to unweight and do cross-under...thus the cambered preference) but it is not as snappy/poppy and slightly squirrely when bombing compared to a women's cambered. A women's board will be playful and easy to learn on compared to a men's board that is slightly too wide....and width does matter...my perfect waist width for my hellish small feet is 24cm on my Option trinity and with my billy goat split at 25.2 cm I'm anticipating really pushing the limit. Again, I'd highly recommend a gnu b-pro for off the rack or calling Venture for a custom specd.
 
#39 · (Edited)
Park pickle is 25.5 for both the 156 and 159...Imho you want closer to 24 and not over 25 cm. Width becomes more noticable as you get tired or laxed...it will feel like you are driving a dump truck compared to agile sports car. If your resort is big wide groomers where you can just cruise verse a tight technical and dodging things/people, steeps or trees you want agility = narrowness. You can make anything work...my charlie slasher 164 is 26 cm and it floats like a dream in 3+ ft of pow and I can make it down any tracked and packed out double black but its not fun. Have you checked out Venture? And btw where are you riding, what snow conditions and terrain?....cause riding ice vs pow or even packed and vs wide open bowls/groomers verse tight technical coulier and trees.
 
#40 ·
Have a look at the YES range. They come fairly narrow and with 180lbs I'd say you would be fine on a trouble 154 (24.6 waist), especially if you use it for park. Or a TDF even though the latter is cambered.

It's not 100% ideal but I'd rather have a fairly short board for my weight than something that is too wide.
 
#41 ·
Hi Neliz,

You are getting some great advice now from a wider group of riders. I don't want to discourage your riding in any way. You obviously are already having a great time riding and our goal now is to find you the gear that is the best match possible.

The Flow Drifter 156 is one option. It is 24.9 at the waist and 25.7 at the center inserts. That is getting closer. Every little bit of width that you lose will help you.
 
#42 ·
Excuse me if I'm wrong here but isn't the whatever narrower than the Gnu Park Pickle?
And wired, A couple of pages back you said that with the other boards I would be able to get an OK fit, but not perfect. The thing is, I'm not going to devote my whole life to snowboarding and I would be ok with a board that isn't "perfect" for me. Does it matter that much or should I just let the bataleon boards go completely? Since the Whatever is narrower I don't see what's better about the Pickle than the Whatever?
 
#43 · (Edited)
I think you are still using the waist as your width mesurement. You need to focus on the width at the inserts where you will stand. The waist on the Whatever is narrower but because it has a deeper sidecut, it gains back that width at the inserts. The Magnetraction decks will give you additional bite into the hardpack that you will encounter.

We can only advise you and if you have decided that you want to try TBT I do not want to stand in your way. I suggest TBT here regularly but as mentioned I think there are better options for your specifics. I would suggest a deck with magnetraction or a narrower model like the Flow Drifter over your TBT choices.
 
#44 ·
Well , I did have my heart set on a TBT board. But if what you're saying is right, and I'd ride easier ans have more fun on a narrower board, I'm Just going to have to give up on the TBT.
I've looked at some of the boards you've suggested, and the one's I've "found" are:
Yes boards, Lib-tech boards, the Gnu park pickle and the Flow Drifter. Am I right thinking that these boards/manufacturers are narrower than the average board? By the way, I'd also like to avoid riding a "girl board" as much as possible. Would any of these boards be a good pick for my kind of riding?:)

PS, I want to thank everyone that has helped me with this, a big thank you to all you guys!
 
#51 ·
I have a Never Summer Lotus 157cm deck, It's a chicks board. (below are the stats).
Just make sure it doesn't look like a chic stick, it's not hard considering all the poofter boards out there.

I don't give a flyin fuck what anyone thinks & if they're gonna start talkin' shit, they better be really really fuckin' good.

Cause if they ain't I'm gonna follow em all day, barkin' shit @ em, swervin' towards em'.
They'll never say somethin' like that to anyone ever again for fear this dink might be hidin' around the corner..:eek:

This is from here, http://www.snowboardingforum.com/boards/44347-how-big-difference-between-ns-premier.html#post454652


Here are the stats on the Never Summer
size waist edge sidecut tip/tail Dampness Flex
Lotus 157 23.8 122 vario700 28.6/28.4 8.5 4
Premier 157 24.9 122 vario745 29.3 7 5.5

It may be a girls board but here are a couple pics. The guys Burton Hero, I had last year.
& the Never Summer Lotus. (chick stick)

One of these boards just reeks of ****, I think we know which one. Who the fuck picks pink & purple then decides "Oh ya I think I'll throw on a Seal balancing a beach ball, Ahh! perfect"

Not this *******!!, I only got it cause it was super cheap & almost brand new.

Stoked is an understatement, I giddy like a school girl with a girl deck.

TT
 

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#50 ·
Someone also mentioned YES snowboards, i was bored so i looked at thier specs and they seem to run narrower then other brands. a The Greats 156 has a 24.7 width. A YES basic has 155 has a 24.9 waist width.

The point is this, bataleon makes a good product. Thier tech isnt the end all be all. No matter which bataleon you get it will not be the right size for you. I have ridden 4 different bataleons, I wont be riding them anymore because I break them all :(

There are a lot of options out there for you, but there are a lot less options then someone of a larger footprint.

If you really really want a bataleon find a used one or see if you can demo one first. If you are happy w/ the performance then so be it. To invest in buying on that will definately not fix you is a recipe for buyers remorse. Additionally buying a different board without completely believing the advice you are being given is another recipe for buyers remorse.

So what i think is. Find a super cheap bataleon in "your size" ride it and then when it doesnt work move on to something you like that was suggested. If it works then so be it you are happy and can replace the cheap one with a newer better model. A $100 or so experiment is better then a $500 mistake.
 
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