Beginner snowboard invention - Page 2 - Snowboarding Forum

Nivek · 01-15-2013, 07:10 PM

You really think you have something more durable and easier to ride than Burtons LTR series? Burton is the number 1 manufacturer of rental equipement. They have been for years. Part of holding that market is making the easiest boards to ride that are more durable than anyone elses.

Rental technology is realistically more concerned with durability and the longevity of the product. It needs to be a smart investment for the shop bringing it in. Designing a board that is easy to ride is wildly easy. I can sit down and pump one of those out in AutoCad in 30 mintues. The learning curve in the sport draws way more from the body than the equipment anyway. You use muscles you never knew you had. Which means it takes time to hone them and get them to a developemental point that allows for fine control.

Burton being the number one rental equipment dealer is a part of why they are also the largest brand name in the industry. Someone completely new to the sport is more likely to spend their first days on the mountain with a big B under their feet. When it comes time to purchase their own gear they already have experience with Burton and are then much more likely to just get a Burton set up. Get 'em early.

Shops buy rental gear in large bulk. Bulk buys get discounts. Manufacturers dont make their money selling rentals based on high margins, but instead on high volume. It will cut significantly into their profits if they have to licsence their designs from an outsider.

I'm wondering what kind of market reasearch was done before your firm started work on this project. If you had done what was needed you'd have either been prepared for this reaction from the industry, or not gone forward with the project at all from the start.

And finally, you are going about the product completely backwards. The concept of making the true "beginner" snowboard suggests your market is the end consumer who is actually riding the board. That is the wrong approach. Your end consumer is the shops buying the boards or the the brands you're trying to liscence to. How are you going to convince them what you have is worth a full change over from what has been working just fine for the last 4 years?

Sorry to break it to you but you and your firm have spent that last however many years designing and testing something the snowboard industry does not need.

Oh and I guess one more thing, the beginner stage is not long enough to warrant a product that spent 2 years in the R&D phase. I have a friend that started hitting 40 footers her fourth year. Another who is doing shit on jibs I'll probably never do his fifth year on snow and I've been riding since Y2K. "high end" board construction has progressed to a point where one doesnt need to be on "beginner" equipment for even a full season anymore.

Ian Rees · 01-15-2013, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nivek

You really think you have something more durable and easier to ride than Burtons LTR series? Burton is the number 1 manufacturer of rental equipement. They have been for years. Part of holding that market is making the easiest boards to ride that are more durable than anyone elses.

Rental technology is realistically more concerned with durability and the longevity of the product. It needs to be a smart investment for the shop bringing it in. Designing a board that is easy to ride is wildly easy. I can sit down and pump one of those out in AutoCad in 30 mintues. The learning curve in the sport draws way more from the body than the equipment anyway. You use muscles you never knew you had. Which means it takes time to hone them and get them to a developemental point that allows for fine control.

Burton being the number one rental equipment dealer is a part of why they are also the largest brand name in the industry. Someone completely new to the sport is more likely to spend their first days on the mountain with a big B under their feet. When it comes time to purchase their own gear they already have experience with Burton and are then much more likely to just get a Burton set up. Get 'em early.

Shops buy rental gear in large bulk. Bulk buys get discounts. Manufacturers dont make their money selling rentals based on high margins, but instead on high volume. It will cut significantly into their profits if they have to licsence their designs from an outsider.

I'm wondering what kind of market reasearch was done before your firm started work on this project. If you had done what was needed you'd have either been prepared for this reaction from the industry, or not gone forward with the project at all from the start.

And finally, you are going about the product completely backwards. The concept of making the true "beginner" snowboard suggests your market is the end consumer who is actually riding the board. That is the wrong approach. Your end consumer is the shops buying the boards or the the brands you're trying to liscence to. How are you going to convince them what you have is worth a full change over from what has been working just fine for the last 4 years?

Sorry to break it to you but you and your firm have spent that last however many years designing and testing something the snowboard industry does not need.

Oh and I guess one more thing, the beginner stage is not long enough to warrant a product that spent 2 years in the R&D phase. I have a friend that started hitting 40 footers her fourth year. Another who is doing shit on jibs I'll probably never do his fifth year on snow and I've been riding since Y2K. "high end" board construction has progressed to a point where one doesnt need to be on "beginner" equipment for even a full season anymore.

In our opinion, with strategy, large Snowboard Companies need to keep coming up with new and worthy product initiatives to maintain market share. And smaller Snowboard Companies look to introduce new and worthy product initiatives to gain market share. We are searching for a Snowboard Company who sees merit in branding, manufacturing and marketing a uniquely different dedicated Beginner Snowboard. Our design concepts as incorporated in our last working prototype provides relevant "beginner" performance in the snowboard which is conducive to improved rider learning. Whether the snowboard rental market better caters to beginner riders with a snowboard like ours is yet to be seen? Whether there is a Snowboard Company out there which is interested in the merit of our working prototype is the nature of our enquiry of this forum.

Jollybored · 01-15-2013, 09:08 PM

Going back to Niveks post, who was your intended target market?

I ask as most people do proceed through the "beginner" stages quite fast and look to own a first board that they can grow into moving on from rentals. Otherwise many like myself, end up buying some second hand board for cheap as their first boards - Is it feasible for a beginner to buy your product first?

Just my 2c

Ian Rees · 01-15-2013, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jollybored

Going back to Niveks post, who was your intended target market?

I ask as most people do proceed through the "beginner" stages quite fast and look to own a first board that they can grow into moving on from rentals. Otherwise many like myself, end up buying some second hand board for cheap as their first boards - Is it feasible for a beginner to buy your product first?

Just my 2c

The Beginner Snowboard primarily caters to Snowboard Rental Companies providing learners/beginners with a more appropriate snowboard catering to their beginner performance needs. With beginners exchanging and progressing to a normal snowboard once more proficient.

BigmountainVMD · 01-15-2013, 09:58 PM

By the way guys, I have this cool project I've been working on. It's called the Auto-Xpert Snowboard. If you are intermediate or advanced, riding this board will make you an expert in a much shorter period of time. I messed with the base to alter speed, motion mechanics, and the tendency of the surface to repel water, which when done properly, will make you a fucking shred machine. That's about all I can tell you (sorry, no pics, or real information of any kind... I got them patents though). Anyone got the hookup on some snowboard company CEO email to pedal my miracle board? If you wanna know more about it, I got some some legal documents you can sign.

^^ This is how you sound to me.

NoOtherOptions · 01-15-2013, 11:58 PM

As an attorney myself, I'm surprised your patent attorney's havn't helped you guys out some more in respect to the whole confidentiality agreement thing. Also, did you guys jump straight to talking to patent attorneys? You don't need a patent attorney to discuss confidentiality agreements, even if it is in relation to something you have patented you just need someone who has sat on the patent bar for the patenting process itself. I say this because patent attorney's tend to be some of the highest paid per hour attorney's around. I do some some soft IP stuff myself (copyrights, trademarks) so I wish you luck.

Nivek · 01-16-2013, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian Rees

The Beginner Snowboard primarily caters to Snowboard Rental Companies providing learners/beginners with a more appropriate snowboard catering to their beginner performance needs. With beginners exchanging and progressing to a normal snowboard once more proficient.

You're better off trying to get this to market on your own as your own brand. Even still, I'm telling you that this has to be a complete paradigm shift in snowboard construction. I cant see a way for this to be drastically better than what is out there without it being drastically different than a snowboard. The idea of a beginner board is to make a snowboard as close to what you'll be riding later on, while still making the learning curve easier. You're supposed to be learing to ride a "snowboard", if you change it too much you ruin that and I cant help but think whatever it is you've come up with, if it really is so amazing, will develope bad habits that hinder the rider later on.

01-15-2013, 07:10 PM	#11 (permalink)
Nivek Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Mountains of Mordor Posts: 5,417	You really think you have something more durable and easier to ride than Burtons LTR series? Burton is the number 1 manufacturer of rental equipement. They have been for years. Part of holding that market is making the easiest boards to ride that are more durable than anyone elses. Rental technology is realistically more concerned with durability and the longevity of the product. It needs to be a smart investment for the shop bringing it in. Designing a board that is easy to ride is wildly easy. I can sit down and pump one of those out in AutoCad in 30 mintues. The learning curve in the sport draws way more from the body than the equipment anyway. You use muscles you never knew you had. Which means it takes time to hone them and get them to a developemental point that allows for fine control. Burton being the number one rental equipment dealer is a part of why they are also the largest brand name in the industry. Someone completely new to the sport is more likely to spend their first days on the mountain with a big B under their feet. When it comes time to purchase their own gear they already have experience with Burton and are then much more likely to just get a Burton set up. Get 'em early. Shops buy rental gear in large bulk. Bulk buys get discounts. Manufacturers dont make their money selling rentals based on high margins, but instead on high volume. It will cut significantly into their profits if they have to licsence their designs from an outsider. I'm wondering what kind of market reasearch was done before your firm started work on this project. If you had done what was needed you'd have either been prepared for this reaction from the industry, or not gone forward with the project at all from the start. And finally, you are going about the product completely backwards. The concept of making the true "beginner" snowboard suggests your market is the end consumer who is actually riding the board. That is the wrong approach. Your end consumer is the shops buying the boards or the the brands you're trying to liscence to. How are you going to convince them what you have is worth a full change over from what has been working just fine for the last 4 years? Sorry to break it to you but you and your firm have spent that last however many years designing and testing something the snowboard industry does not need. Oh and I guess one more thing, the beginner stage is not long enough to warrant a product that spent 2 years in the R&D phase. I have a friend that started hitting 40 footers her fourth year. Another who is doing shit on jibs I'll probably never do his fifth year on snow and I've been riding since Y2K. "high end" board construction has progressed to a point where one doesnt need to be on "beginner" equipment for even a full season anymore. __________________ Snowboarding Sucks. Buy my stuff 2014 Flow Rush LTD 153 $200 2014 Flow Fuse SE Med $100 2012 Trek Remedy Carbon 9.8 $3500 http://rockies.craigslist.org/bik/3766331309.html Last edited by Nivek; 01-15-2013 at 07:15 PM.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

01-15-2013, 09:08 PM	#13 (permalink)
Jollybored Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 85	Going back to Niveks post, who was your intended target market? I ask as most people do proceed through the "beginner" stages quite fast and look to own a first board that they can grow into moving on from rentals. Otherwise many like myself, end up buying some second hand board for cheap as their first boards - Is it feasible for a beginner to buy your product first? Just my 2c

01-15-2013, 09:58 PM	#15 (permalink)
BigmountainVMD Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 689	By the way guys, I have this cool project I've been working on. It's called the Auto-Xpert Snowboard. If you are intermediate or advanced, riding this board will make you an expert in a much shorter period of time. I messed with the base to alter speed, motion mechanics, and the tendency of the surface to repel water, which when done properly, will make you a fucking shred machine. That's about all I can tell you (sorry, no pics, or real information of any kind... I got them patents though). Anyone got the hookup on some snowboard company CEO email to pedal my miracle board? If you wanna know more about it, I got some some legal documents you can sign. ^^ This is how you sound to me.

01-15-2013, 11:58 PM	#16 (permalink)
NoOtherOptions Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 319	As an attorney myself, I'm surprised your patent attorney's havn't helped you guys out some more in respect to the whole confidentiality agreement thing. Also, did you guys jump straight to talking to patent attorneys? You don't need a patent attorney to discuss confidentiality agreements, even if it is in relation to something you have patented you just need someone who has sat on the patent bar for the patenting process itself. I say this because patent attorney's tend to be some of the highest paid per hour attorney's around. I do some some soft IP stuff myself (copyrights, trademarks) so I wish you luck.