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Old 11-15-2012, 07:18 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by david_z View Post
Bingo.

Figuring a 3 month season, 4 if we're really lucky, they're probably blowing snow on average 4-5 days a week from late November through February. That shit ain't cheap.

Most of these places also operate 12+ hours per day instead of 7-8 hours per day out West where only a handful of mountains operate after 4pm.

Most of these places are also located a stone's throw from major metropolitan areas. There are 4 ski areas within 30 minutes of my house in fair weather, and there are 1.5 or 2 million people in the same situation. So there's a very captive audience of people who dno't ski maybe 5-7 times per season, but they ahve to price high enough to keep these folks buying day passes instead of season passes, etc.
Good point about the lighting. That's extra costs there.

Wilmot doesn't appear to have lodging to soak up extra cash either.
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Old 11-15-2012, 07:24 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Lots of things. Shorter season, snow making costs, night operations, and such. Let's also not forget, that if you are a visitor to Colorado, and most other destination places, your lift ticket is costing you $100 a day. Cheaper passes for locals are subsidized by higher lift ticket costs. I am sure that operating expense for say Snowbird for a season is way more expensive than Boyne, but they have a longer season and a much higher number of visits. I'd bet skier visits at Winterpark are probably in the neighborhood of 10x the number of any given Med West resort. That is a lot of money.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:13 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Some good points, but I don't think the operating costs can possibly be higher than the mountain resorts out West. Not sure if you guys have been out there? They are huge operations in quite a wild setting.

To give you an idea of some of the operating costs out West:
- Snoqualmie is open until 10pm 6 days a week at Alpental, Summit Central and Summit West, which offer a huge amount of terrain (compared to Midwest resorts) and you bet they have a ton of lighting
- perform avalanche control and monitoring daily
- have a large staff of ski patrol to cover the much larger and more dangerous terrain
- higher quantity of lifts which are also much longer
- plenty of onsite medical assistance (which is probably true for midwest as well )
- the grooming costs are obviously going to be higher for the size and complexity of the terrain out West
- the insane amount of snowfall which is a huge plus for the obvious reasons, but the maintenance costs associated with keeping the local road ways/paths and parking lots are very high and a constant job

But I don't know, you could all be right, its just really hard for me to imagine how the operating costs could be higher in the Midwest just because of making snow.

It could be related to the volume of sales in relationship to profit but it seems like there is a lot of competition out here, especially in WI, which would drive costs down further. I really don't know how it all breaks down.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:45 PM   #14 (permalink)
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This is our 3rd year getting a family pass at Alpine Valley. For the 3 of us $1400.
Last year in a very bad weather year I rode 35 ish days. I don't have a clue to operation costs but on a busy weekend they can have up to 14 full buses of people from Chicago spending tons of money. lift ticket, lessons, gear, food, bar....

As stated earlier it's close to home, I can ride often, and it's what we got so enjoy it. Even on the bad days I can get some good runs in or simply drive home.
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Old 11-15-2012, 08:54 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I think that for the folks living in or near Metro area's, Detroit, Chicago, etc. I imagine that greed & the "Captive" audience is probably a more valid argument.

I don't know any other way to explain how a season pass for a crappy little hill like Mt Brighton is $550, and yet a silver pass @ Boyne (covering multiple resorts, I might add and /w only 10 blackout days) goes for the same $550????

I might,.. might pay that for Pine Knob,.. but it would still be hard to make it there enough times in a season to get it to pay off!
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Old 11-17-2012, 09:47 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I agree 550 is outrageous for a place like Wilmot. I paid 340 for a season pass at Wilmot this year but I bought mine before July 31st. Wilmot is super close and easy to get to for me so it is kind of my fall back if I don't feel like taking a road trip. I'm not sure if other places have deals like this but at 340 it more than pays for itself in 10 trips.
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Old 11-17-2012, 10:36 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Holy S man! $550.00 for Wilmot that seems like over kill to me. I'm not familiar w/ that resort just from reading their website and observing there "mountain" trial map it's ridiculously priced.

Wilmot Mountain Location Kenosha County, Wisconsin, U.S. Nearest city Wilmot, Wisconsin Vertical 190 ft (58 m) Top elevation 960 ft (293 m)[1] Base elevation 770 ft (235 m) Skiable area 120 acres (0.49 km2) Runs 25 Longest run 2,500 ft (760 m) Lift system 11 chairlifts - vintage! Lift capacity 12,500 skiers/hr Terrain parks 5 Snowfall 48 in (120 cm) Snowmaking Yes Night skiing Yes Web site wilmotmountain.com

A vertical drop of 190 ft. Ha this made me laugh. Our bunny hills have more vertical drop than that. and a skiable area of 120 acres being located near major metropolis = big crowds.



Just to give you some comparison

[Crystal Mountain Skiers on Crystal Mountain's slopes Location Mount Baker-Snoqualmie National Forest Pierce County, Washington United States Nearest city Enumclaw 40 mi. (65 km) north Coordinates 46°55′40″N 121°28′56″W Vertical 3100 ft (945 m) 2602 ft (793 m) - lifts Top elevation 7012 ft (2137 m) 7002 ft (2134 m) - lifts Base elevation 3912 ft (1192 m) 4400 ft (1341 m) - lifts Skiable area 2,600 acres (11 km2) lift serviced: 2300 acres (9.3 km˛) inbounds backcountry 300 acres (1.2 km˛) Runs 57 - 11% easiest - 54% more difficult - 35% most difficult Longest run 2.5 mi (4 km) "Northway" Lift system 1 Gondola 10 chairs 1 magic carpet Lift capacity 20,760 / hr Terrain parks 1 Snowfall 350 inches (8.9 m) Snowmaking none Night skiing none Web site crystalmountainresort.com



Last year I purchased two 5 day passes @ $320.00 a piece. My son and I then went up an additional 15 times at the daily lift rate+gondola = $74.00 a day totaling $1,110.00 for a season grand total of $1,420.00 for the two of us. Not to include gas making the 2 hour trip and food at the resort.

This year I purchased two gold member season passes for the Summit at Snoqualmie for right around $1200.00 back in July.


Location Snoqualmie Pass, Washington, United States
Nearest city North Bend (18 miles west)
Coordinates 47°24′36″N 121°24′21″W
Vertical 2,280 ft
Alpental – 2,280 ft
Summit Central – 1,025 ft
Summit West – 765 ft
Summit East – 1,100 ft
Top elevation 5420 ft (Alpental)
Base elevation 2610 ft (Summit East)
Skiable area 1,914 acres (7.75 km2) (combined)
Runs 62 (combined)
- 14% easiest
- 45% more difficult
- 41% most difficult
Longest run 1.2 mi International
Lift system 18 chairs, 6 surface lifts
Alpental:
4 chairs, 1 surface lift
Summit Central:
7 chairs, 3 surface lifts
Summit West:
5 chairs, 2 surface lifts
Summit East:
2 chairs
Snowfall 435 in
Web site summitatsnoqualmie.com - official site

http://www.summitatsnoqualmie.com/fi...talMap2012.pdf

http://www.summitatsnoqualmie.com/fi...itWest2012.pdf

http://www.summitatsnoqualmie.com/fi...entral2012.pdf

http://www.summitatsnoqualmie.com/fi...itEast2012.pdf


So to me to pay $550.00 for a mound i mean excuse me " Wilmot mountain" seems a little over priced in comparison. Though if it's all I had then I guess I'd pay it but I sure as shit would not be happy about it. In fact it's probably be enough to make me move.
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Old 11-17-2012, 11:02 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Come on Dirty....we all don't live out west and most can't afford to move just to ride awesome mountains. I have long be a proponent of ride what you got. It may be small, crappy and expensive, but we are out there doing what we love. Hoping that learning to ride these brutal conditions will make us better riders for when we can get to a great resort.

Here is my home hill specs:
  • 90 skiable acres
  • 20 Runs
  • longest run is 3,000 feet
  • 3 high speed detachable quads
  • brutal terrain park conditions most of the time
  • 90% man-made snow

I'm not going to complain, because with last years crap winter/conditions I got in 35ish days riding (one week I rode 6 of 7 days) for a season that is only 3 months long, 4 months if it is an awesome year.
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Old 11-17-2012, 11:10 AM   #19 (permalink)
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No I totally get what you mean ride what you've got. I also know the terrain of the country varies drastically from east to west north and south. I was just making a point that the value of what your getting for the price your paying is pretty crappy.
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Old 11-17-2012, 11:21 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Yeah no shit Dirty you are making me sick... I am well aware that I live in the absolute worst part of the country I could for the sports I am into. Like you said though it is what it is pretty much.
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