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  Topic Review (Newest First)
01-20-2009 03:24 AM
Edvard_Grieg Thank you for the great write-up! I went up to Keystone on Sunday after tweaking my stance a bit, and I found that ended up helping a lot. I still think a different board would *that* much more, but I wanted to mention that as a valid point to anyone else in a similar situation.

The changes I made were to widen the stance (now at the furthest holes on each side) and to make the back food at a more aggressive angle...I'll probably tweak the foot angles a little more as I keep going, but I wanted to mention that overall making those changes gave me a lot more control which translated to tighter turns etc.

Along the same lines, I'm also now more confident in being able to handle an equally long and stiffer board than my current Glissade Big Gun 175.

Thanks again everyone!
01-12-2009 12:08 PM
MunkySpunk Just got a chance to bring out the Zephyr for the first time this season, so I thought I'd relay my experiences with each one while it's fresh in my head. Again, I'm 6'3", 200lbs, size 14, +18/0 goofy stance.

Keep in mind while you're reading this, I fly a Titan TX 161 (26.3cm waist) and a Zephyr 166 wide (28cm waist), and I've got no doubt that difference in length and width affected some of the outcomes. I also use Burton elevators with my Titan and do not with my Zephyr.

The Zephyr is a more forgiving board than the TX, but it's definitely not as agile. Also, I tried to pay more attention to the speed factor with the Zephyr. The TX is definitely the faster board, but the Zephyr is nothing to sneeze at either. Unless you're looking to break records or enter official races, the Zephyr will absolutely be fast enough for you.

The Zephyr got a bit squirrely on me at really high speeds in a few places, but it wasn't anything I couldn't recover from on the fly, and it certainly wasn't major crash-inducing wobble. However, if I had hit the wrong kind of bump at the wrong time on the Zephyr and caught an edge during a squirrel-out, I might have gone flying. All in all, the fact that I didn't go flying in some of those spots is a testament to the Zephyr's more forgiving build. If I were to have gone through those motions on my Titan, it probably would have laughed at me and then used me for impact protection as it bounced me off the slope side until I was its bitch.

The Titan can definitely hold a better line at speed. Just like NS says, you've never experienced a faster, smoother, and more responsive board than the Titan... you just gotta keep the bitch on a leash or she'll put you on your ass.

The Zephyr is an easier board to land when you get air. It came down with a solid 'whomp' and kept going straight as an arrow, whereas the Titan would sometimes wobble for an instant when I landed and I'd have to adjust. This could be due to the extreme differences in width.

The carving trophy goes to the Zephyr, no question (again, keep in mind, 166 vs. 161). If I saw something shiney over there and I wanted to head in that direction, the Zephyr took me there, no matter how tight a turn I asked it to do. It was't as agile (read: multiple quick transitions) as the Titan, but you'd never have guessed you were riding a 28cm wide board either.

At low speeds, when glide-skating from the lift to the top of a run, the Zephyr was easier to control. I sometimes have issues with my board kind of rotating however it wants to while I'm skating long distances, but the Zephyr was much easier to handle in this regard.

At low speeds with both feet in (like hanging with my wife on the novice hill), the Titan was easier to control, but again, size differences surely came into play here.

So basically you've gotta ask yourself if you can handle the Titan (Honestly, I'm still wrestling with the bitch in spots). I think it's a better high-speed freeride board if you have the sack to keep it under control. It asks a lot but gives a lot. The Zephyr is more forgiving and holds a better tight carve (it was also longer, tho). If you're the kind of rider who likes speed, can bend a board to his will and doesn't need its forgiveness, you probably want to hit up the Titan. I still benefit from a board showing me a modicum of compassion, personally... I'm not the double black diamond type yet.

At the end of the day, however, you're going to get a big wide board chubby in your pants no matter which you get.. I promise. These are both superb sticks that deserve every bit of the good rep they have.
01-10-2009 05:02 PM
MunkySpunk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mysticfalcon View Post
My sugestion would be for a smokin magnetraction 175. Ive got a friend who rides one thats 6'8 and about 240lb. I'm 5'10 and Ride the Smokin traction 162. Amazing ride adn very stiff. It is the ultimate board for high speed blue and black runs. Ive got other boards but that is what I ride the most.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edvard_Grieg View Post
Thanks again! I'd also be curious for any comments/insight into Magnetraction/Banana Tech (Lib Tech's stuff) I'm obviously very in the dark on this stuff, and really don't understand what it is/does.
I've got no experience with magnetraction. All I know is what is on their website. I've heard good things about it when it comes to ice. I'd love to try it myself - but there's no place even remotely close to me that does it.
01-09-2009 01:46 AM
Edvard_Grieg
Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkySpunk View Post
Both. By dead reckoning, if one were to scale the Titan up to the size of the Zephyr 166 Wide, it'd still weigh less than the Zephyr. You can't quote me on that, I've got nothing to back this up.
I'm not gonna bullshit you, that's more than I'm qualified to answer. Every single board mfg out there will tell you their sidecuts make it a better board using lingo and jargon that makes your head spin. I DO know what they mean by quadratic vs. tri-radial in a purely mathematical sense. But other than the basics of swallow-tail, tapered, progressive, or twin, I don't know why they do what they do at the end of the day.
Anyone else wanna school me out there?
Thanks again! I'd also be curious for any comments/insight into Magnetraction/Banana Tech (Lib Tech's stuff) I'm obviously very in the dark on this stuff, and really don't understand what it is/does.
01-08-2009 07:45 PM
MunkySpunk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edvard_Grieg View Post
That made sense- when you say the Zephyr has more mass, are you strictly speaking because it is longer, or is it actually a thicker/denser board?
Both. By dead reckoning, if one were to scale the Titan up to the size of the Zephyr 166 Wide, it'd still weigh less than the Zephyr. You can't quote me on that, I've got nothing to back this up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edvard_Grieg View Post
Do you know anything about the edge cuts? The Zephyr uses a quadratic cut, whereas I don't believe the Titan does....do you think that could be contributing to the edge-holding differences too, or do you think it's just length?
I'm not gonna bullshit you, that's more than I'm qualified to answer. Every single board mfg out there will tell you their sidecuts make it a better board using lingo and jargon that makes your head spin. I DO know what they mean by quadratic vs. tri-radial in a purely mathematical sense. But other than the basics of swallow-tail, tapered, progressive, or twin, I don't know why they do what they do at the end of the day.
Anyone else wanna school me out there?
01-08-2009 05:52 PM
Mysticfalcon My sugestion would be for a smokin magnetraction 175. Ive got a friend who rides one thats 6'8 and about 240lb. I'm 5'10 and Ride the Smokin traction 162. Amazing ride adn very stiff. It is the ultimate board for high speed blue and black runs. Ive got other boards but that is what I ride the most.
01-08-2009 05:16 PM
Edvard_Grieg
Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkySpunk View Post
The Zephyr definitely holds an edge better than my Titan, no question. There is a caveat to that assessment however: My Zephyr is longer and therefore has a longer effective edge, and will by definition, hold better than a shorter board of the same construction.

The only way to really test out edge holding in a controlled manner would be to have the same person ride one of each of the same length with the same boots/bindings on the same hill... I'm not in a position to do that. However, if I were to make a judgement call, I'd say the Zephyr held the better edge in any conditions. If you want to go a particular direction, as long as you've got the leg strength to turn the board and the momentum to go the distance, the Zephyr will hold the edge to get you where you want to go, period.
Cool Deal

Quote:
As for moguls, it depends on what you mean by moguls and how you're hitting them. Do you mean the large bumps that the skiers build up on a slope over the course of a day (and then curse you for heelsiding them flat), or do you mean proper resort-constructed moguls? Do you want to just kill the mogul or have some fun on it?
I generally don't seek out the deliberate mogul fields, but a fair number of the blacks (and some blue/blue-blacks) get large mogul buildups...not necessarily something that flattens by riding heelside either (either covering a boulder or otherwise). I wouldn't mind trying to get better on the tigher/smaller moguls, but I'm doubtful that would be primary....I'm thinking more the massive moguls carved from pow-pow.

Quote:
The speed difference seems marginal, although I've never actually clocked myself or had anyone watch me, so it's all based on perception. I'm constantly amazed at how the Titan just builds up speed when you so much as sneeze with your face turned uphill. The Titan just wants to go fast, really fast. I don't get that feeling with the Zephyr, but the Zephyr has more mass, so it could all boil down to inertia: If you have two boards of equal performance but different mass, the heavier one will take longer to get up to speed even though they would both have very close terminal velocities (Newton's 1st law of motion).
That made sense- when you say the Zephyr has more mass, are you strictly speaking because it is longer, or is it actually a thicker/denser board?

Quote:
The biggest performance change you'd notice between a 166 and a 171, aside from the agility, is that the 171 would hold an edge better during a carve b/c it's got a longer effective edge. I'm not sure that the added mass of a 171 would be enough to make a difference when smashing moguls, but I've never been there. I personally prefer a board that's a bit shorter (if you go by strict height:length proportion rules, 168 would be my board length) for the added agility, even though I don't hit the park. If you're 290 and hitting the black diamonds, it doesn't sound like leg strength is even remotely an issue for you, so you might be able to just bully a longer board into doing what you want. It's a trade-off, shorter is easier to turn and more responsive, but the longer will let you lay down some truly epic S carves. I've never had trouble carving on my Zephyr 166 in all but the shittiest conditions, but I'm also 90 pounds less.
Yeah, leg strength isn't a huge issue- keep in mind I've been riding a 175 I'm just trying to determine if that was overkill. Prior to it I always rode 168/169...and I guess in my mind 2cm shouldn't mean anything <shrug>...but maybe it does? I don't think I feel comfortable going quite to a 166 though...just seems too short lol.

Quote:
As for needing a longer board just b/c of the weight: We're talking NS and Venture here, they'll both take your punishment in stride. You could ride a NS 128cm kid's board and it'll smile back up at you. It's the float-factor you'll need to consider - a shorter board will put a larger amount of lbs/inch^2 on the snow and you'll tend to sink just a little bit further down. Is the difference enough to warrant a longer board? I dunno, if you board in hip-deep pow all the time, it becomes important to keep that nose up. If you board on East Coast ice, then you really won't sink anyway.

I hope I've helped. Feed me more info on your mogul intentions and I'll see if I can help more.
I ride Summit County, CO, so it's good snow, and either packed pow or powder most of the time. I don't go 'hip deep' often, but then again, like you...my hips are pretty high up

Do you know anything about the edge cuts? The Zephyr uses a quadratic cut, whereas I don't believe the Titan does....do you think that could be contributing to the edge-holding differences too, or do you think it's just length?

Thanks again!
01-08-2009 11:04 AM
MunkySpunk
Quote:
Originally Posted by Edvard_Grieg View Post
Awesome! Thank you very much for the reply! Would you say that one holds an edge better than the other? How about in moguls? (just starting to do some, and I know it will be tricky with either)

Is the speed difference significant or marginal? I'm thinking since I'll probably be looking at a 171 ish I'll be getting nice speed one way or the other...not to mention mass does lend itself towards ridiculous speed in its own right Do you think I could ride something shorter? Aside from being easier to turn- what other changes would I notice between a 166 and a 171?

loved the analogies btw
The Zephyr definitely holds an edge better than my Titan, no question. There is a caveat to that assessment however: My Zephyr is longer and therefore has a longer effective edge, and will by definition, hold better than a shorter board of the same construction.

The only way to really test out edge holding in a controlled manner would be to have the same person ride one of each of the same length with the same boots/bindings on the same hill... I'm not in a position to do that. However, if I were to make a judgement call, I'd say the Zephyr held the better edge in any conditions. If you want to go a particular direction, as long as you've got the leg strength to turn the board and the momentum to go the distance, the Zephyr will hold the edge to get you where you want to go, period.

As for moguls, it depends on what you mean by moguls and how you're hitting them. Do you mean the large bumps that the skiers build up on a slope over the course of a day (and then curse you for heelsiding them flat), or do you mean proper resort-constructed moguls? Do you want to just kill the mogul or have some fun on it?

The speed difference seems marginal, although I've never actually clocked myself or had anyone watch me, so it's all based on perception. I'm constantly amazed at how the Titan just builds up speed when you so much as sneeze with your face turned uphill. The Titan just wants to go fast, really fast. I don't get that feeling with the Zephyr, but the Zephyr has more mass, so it could all boil down to inertia: If you have two boards of equal performance but different mass, the heavier one will take longer to get up to speed even though they would both have very close terminal velocities (Newton's 1st law of motion).

The biggest performance change you'd notice between a 166 and a 171, aside from the agility, is that the 171 would hold an edge better during a carve b/c it's got a longer effective edge. I'm not sure that the added mass of a 171 would be enough to make a difference when smashing moguls, but I've never been there. I personally prefer a board that's a bit shorter (if you go by strict height:length proportion rules, 168 would be my board length) for the added agility, even though I don't hit the park. If you're 290 and hitting the black diamonds, it doesn't sound like leg strength is even remotely an issue for you, so you might be able to just bully a longer board into doing what you want. It's a trade-off, shorter is easier to turn and more responsive, but the longer will let you lay down some truly epic S carves. I've never had trouble carving on my Zephyr 166 in all but the shittiest conditions, but I'm also 90 pounds less.

As for needing a longer board just b/c of the weight: We're talking NS and Venture here, they'll both take your punishment in stride. You could ride a NS 128cm kid's board and it'll smile back up at you. It's the float-factor you'll need to consider - a shorter board will put a larger amount of lbs/inch^2 on the snow and you'll tend to sink just a little bit further down. Is the difference enough to warrant a longer board? I dunno, if you board in hip-deep pow all the time, it becomes important to keep that nose up. If you board on East Coast ice, then you really won't sink anyway.

I hope I've helped. Feed me more info on your mogul intentions and I'll see if I can help more.
01-08-2009 12:35 AM
Edvard_Grieg
Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkySpunk View Post
Finally, a post I can help out with.

I've got a Venture Zephyr Wide 166, a Titan TX 161, and a few beat up Burton Canyons I hang on the wall b/c of the graphics. I'm 6'3", 200lbs, size 14 feet. Is this getting close enough minus the weight?

If you're looking for speed and control at said speeds, pure and simple, the Titan TX is what you want. It's got no chatter to speak of and it's faster than Reggie Bush on crack. I've got a long, very shallow incline at my home resort right off the high speed lift before you reach any real gradients. You can tell who waxes their boards and who doesn't, as 90% of the people have to stop and skate to go further, but on the Titan I woosh by them every time without fail. It's stiff, but at your professed 290 pounds, just about any board has a high degree of flex. It's got much more flex than the Zephyr, and is a bit thinner. It's a Neversummer, so you know it's built like a brick shithouse. It's my everyday board that I throw at anything but fluffy white powder or rocks (I bounce my Canyons off the rocky stuff).

I save the Zephyr for the nice powder days. It's also fast, not as fast as the Titan, but I don't have any complaints. It's WIDE, the 28cm means I don't have to worry about using lifts/risers. It's also stiffer than Michael Jackson watching the tabernacle boys choir - really stiff. Carving is a dream in this, it's easy, fast, and smooth... like a pint of Ben and Jerry's or a good poop. It's relatively light (given that it's a wide 166 board), but I figure it'd be heavier than the Titan if they were the same size. Speaking of brick shithouses, what strikes me about the board is that it's tough as nails. Minus the edge, it's wrapped top to bottom in p-tex, including a nice textured p-tex topsheet that negates the need for a stomp pad. I'm pretty sure it could stop an armor piercing round (or not...). You can whup up on it like a red-headed step child and it will come back for more. It handles much easier than its size or weight would lead you to believe, although keep in mind it is still a big board... and the carving.. mmm.. carving. It'll keep an edge on really crappy snow better than anything I've ever ridden.

That being said, don't discount NS's construction quality as well.

My rear leg is at 0 degrees and so I need every bit of width I can get out of a board. I use lifts with the Titan, but I don't need them with the Zephyr. I don't think you could possibly go wrong with either one.
Awesome! Thank you very much for the reply! Would you say that one holds an edge better than the other? How about in moguls? (just starting to do some, and I know it will be tricky with either)

Is the speed difference significant or marginal? I'm thinking since I'll probably be looking at a 171 ish I'll be getting nice speed one way or the other...not to mention mass does lend itself towards ridiculous speed in its own right Do you think I could ride something shorter? Aside from being easier to turn- what other changes would I notice between a 166 and a 171?

loved the analogies btw
01-07-2009 09:13 PM
MunkySpunk Finally, a post I can help out with.

I've got a Venture Zephyr Wide 166, a Titan TX 161, and a few beat up Burton Canyons I hang on the wall b/c of the graphics. I'm 6'3", 200lbs, size 14 feet. Is this getting close enough minus the weight?

If you're looking for speed and control at said speeds, pure and simple, the Titan TX is what you want. It's got no chatter to speak of and it's faster than Reggie Bush on crack. I've got a long, very shallow incline at my home resort right off the high speed lift before you reach any real gradients. You can tell who waxes their boards and who doesn't, as 90% of the people have to stop and skate to go further, but on the Titan I woosh by them every time without fail. It's stiff, but at your professed 290 pounds, just about any board has a high degree of flex. It's got much more flex than the Zephyr, and is a bit thinner. It's a Neversummer, so you know it's built like a brick shithouse. It's my everyday board that I throw at anything but fluffy white powder or rocks (I bounce my Canyons off the rocky stuff).

I save the Zephyr for the nice powder days. It's also fast, not as fast as the Titan, but I don't have any complaints. It's WIDE, the 28cm means I don't have to worry about using lifts/risers. It's also stiffer than Michael Jackson watching the tabernacle boys choir - really stiff. Carving is a dream in this, it's easy, fast, and smooth... like a pint of Ben and Jerry's or a good poop. It's relatively light (given that it's a wide 166 board), but I figure it'd be heavier than the Titan if they were the same size. Speaking of brick shithouses, what strikes me about the board is that it's tough as nails. Minus the edge, it's wrapped top to bottom in p-tex, including a nice textured p-tex topsheet that negates the need for a stomp pad. I'm pretty sure it could stop an armor piercing round (or not...). You can whup up on it like a red-headed step child and it will come back for more. It handles much easier than its size or weight would lead you to believe, although keep in mind it is still a big board... and the carving.. mmm.. carving. It'll keep an edge on really crappy snow better than anything I've ever ridden.

That being said, don't discount NS's construction quality as well.

My rear leg is at 0 degrees and so I need every bit of width I can get out of a board. I use lifts with the Titan, but I don't need them with the Zephyr. I don't think you could possibly go wrong with either one.
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