Snowboarding Forum - Snowboard Enthusiast Forums - Reply to Topic
Thread: For You Aussies Strewth Bindings Reply to Thread
Title:
Message:
Trackback:
Send Trackbacks to (Separate multiple URLs with spaces) :
Post Icons
You may choose an icon for your message from the following list:
 
   

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Snowboarding Forum - Snowboard Enthusiast Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



  Additional Options
Miscellaneous Options

  Topic Review (Newest First)
08-29-2014 04:25 PM
BurtonAvenger I'm not missing the point. I get you can't bend down and strap in for whatever reason. Doesn't mean that is what the market is dictating. Is there a minor fragment of the market place that could use this? Probably, but making a whole binding around speed entry and ease when realistically it's not any easier nor is it any faster than other options is a lie.

The cold hard honest truth is 99% of people if given a high end, medium end, and low end binding in a blind test wouldn't notice the difference of getting in and out of it. Some might feel the flex difference, but that percentage would be at most 10%. As long as it A) Worked like it should and B) Got them to the bottom of the run in normal comfort they wouldn't care.

Moving parts always = a fatal design flaw. Step ins where are they now? Dead. Strap in step out bindings where are they? Dead. These two concepts had the most moving parts and the highest failure rate.

Foobar to answer your question. More companies sell mid to low level bindings than high end ones. The high end ones are show pieces for the gear whores more or less while the rest are what the people need. Marketing has a lot to do with this. If more people would think for themselves and not for what the product description is telling them the world would be a far better place, but alas we live in a society where complacency is rewarded and if you're not going with the status quo then there's something wrong.

To go back to my original point these things need serious long term testing.
08-29-2014 03:11 PM
larrytbull I think you miss the point this binding is not what I give a crap about. It is about innovative solutions. I tend to agree there are flaws in the design but flaws can be solved. Provided that the people want to solve them.
BA. I am a huge fan of your site and am happy you spend the time to really call things out as you see them. Just pointing out that other people have different needs. And innovation doesnt alway get right first 100 or so times. Look at edison and lightbulb. The market will ultimately judge as to whether it works or not
08-29-2014 02:21 PM
BurtonAvenger While I fully agree that snowboarding keeps marketing to what has worked and doesn't believe that the biggest age group that made snowboarding huge has gotten older, I don't necessarily agree with what you're saying about this binding.

NO ONE has tested this. Right now it's still a concept binding and that shows. I know for a fact more moving parts = more failures. If you can think of a part on a binding, I or someone I know have broken it.

Truth be told it's not that hard to bend down and strap in, it's not that hard to slide in from the back of a binding and flip up the highback. If my bad knees, mangled back, broken body can do it 200 plus days a year, thousands of times a season I would like to believe other people can to. This argument that it's easier/faster doesn't fly it's not any less easier to reach down and flick a highback open than it is to reach down and pull a lever. Your body is still moving the same and bending down to do the same.

I've watched this binding come and go once on a crowd funded project and seeing it return yet again without any change in what they're doing except a slightly more aesthetically pleasing look doesn't build my confidence in the product. I've seen bindings with release levers come and go before. There's a reason they're not here anymore.
08-29-2014 02:02 PM
td.1000
Quote:
Originally Posted by larrytbull View Post
A horse and buggy can get you down the road and it is simple, but a car does it better. Just took a while for car to really get to this status.
nobody is against developping better bindings. its just that putting more hinges and gears and levers into them is not the right way to go. research materials, geometry, fabrication technologies etc. instead.
08-29-2014 10:30 AM
larrytbull
Quote:
Originally Posted by f00bar View Post
But the question to be asked is whether that is for the benefit of the rider or the manufacturers wallets. Meaning, if the profit on a better product isn't as much as the profit on the lesser, why would you bother developing the better? But that still doesn't change the fact that you could do better.
Not to hijack the thread but BA. You had a really good article not long ago abut stagnation and why the industry is losing rider not gaining. There are many reasons for that, but just like when rocker hit the streets it gave a whole bunch of new potential riders a way to learn easier with less risk, same way the shaped skis helped to save skiing. I think that ideas such as the above bindings help to bring the sport to people who would otherwise not go boarding. Is the above tech the holy grail, I don't really think so, but they address some of the concerns of the older riders who may not have the range of motion of the younger ones. The old guys are the ones with the money, and they have the potential to help revive the industry. Sole reason I ride is because my son wanted to, and the newer tech made it easier for me to ride, till I could progress further. The flows, the rocker... they convinced me it was viable even at my age. (that and mid life crisis)
If the rest of the industry would start to market to the older rider along with coming up with some new tech to support the aging rider. I think it is a winning solution..... just my .02 cents.
Its a win win for every one sport gets more popular and the niche players can make some money along the way. But to reiterate, I don't support just any dumb idea it needs to make sense and more moving parts yes are more complex, but as long as the company puts time in to make a proper product it will sell. A horse and buggy can get you down the road and it is simple, but a car does it better. Just took a while for car to really get to this status.
08-29-2014 10:16 AM
f00bar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BurtonAvenger View Post
Why do bindings work so well? LESS MOVING PARTS! Every time a company integrates more complex parts to it they have more issues and more failures. There's a reason meat and potato bindings are the life bread of bindings.
But the question to be asked is whether that is for the benefit of the rider or the manufacturers wallets. Meaning, if the profit on a better product isn't as much as the profit on the lesser, why would you bother developing the better? But that still doesn't change the fact that you could do better.
08-29-2014 09:49 AM
BurtonAvenger Why do bindings work so well? LESS MOVING PARTS! Every time a company integrates more complex parts to it they have more issues and more failures. There's a reason meat and potato bindings are the life bread of bindings.
08-29-2014 09:38 AM
Strewth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin137 View Post
I am glad you took my comments in the context they where meant, i am not saying your product is crap, i am saying that it is going to be a hard sell...!

I am in Norway, ride with a few pros, and loads of instructors, we have one of the best teaching systems in Norway for bringing through the youth here, and everyone i have shown this 2 has said, no way would i buy them...

This is not because they look crap, but simply because they don't believe they can work in the real world... We have lots of powder and the biggest deal here is clogging up the under tray before pushing down... If that happens, then you have a binding you cannot lock in...!

Biggest failing point in my eyes, which then puts the whole project in doubt as if they don't lock down, or have issues due to conditions, then people will very quickly slate it...!

Get them out, the finished units, to as many people who can test in different conditions, including temps, as well as snow, and revisit next year is my suggestion, you may well end up not getting anywhere with this though...

Talking about temps, have you thought about moving parts and the testing it requires where for us, we have loads of the season at -20 and days as low as -30 Just curious, as everything works differently...!!! Even something as simple as using a go pro becomes hard work...!!! Batteries last a few minutes only... I have actually had boas freeze on me where it has been so cold they would not release... Only once, but was funny sitting in the car with the heater on to defrost them...!!!
Hey Kevin. Yes, they are all valid concerns and probably the same as many people may have. The only way to prove it will be through demoing, so that's what we'll be doing. We've spent a long time on just that type of issue, and the solution is actually pretty simple, but a very valid concern.
08-29-2014 04:43 AM
Kevin137
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strewth View Post
Kevin137 you are 100% correct.

We did actually include a note about the Indiegogo campaign in the Kickstarter campaign. I just went to cut & paste it here but see it didn't make the final edit. You do and redo these things so many times before they go live. Will update and get that back in shortly.

It is also true about timing etc. The main video is the original video from last year with an old prototype. The middle video is a newer prototype.

We've been working with a few different designers and one thing became clear, to design a binding you need a specialist binding designer (might be obvious to some). So we have now done that and are waiting for the samples of the finished binding. Much better than what is in the video, but may not get here in time for the end of the Kickstarter. Either way we will post them up and see what people think, and decide whether to redo a Kickstarter if this one doesn't reach it's goal.

At the end of the day, only riding them will show if they are good or not. I know there's a few people on the forum here who know how to test a binding . We'll put them out there and see what people think.
I am glad you took my comments in the context they where meant, i am not saying your product is crap, i am saying that it is going to be a hard sell...!

I am in Norway, ride with a few pros, and loads of instructors, we have one of the best teaching systems in Norway for bringing through the youth here, and everyone i have shown this 2 has said, no way would i buy them...

This is not because they look crap, but simply because they don't believe they can work in the real world... We have lots of powder and the biggest deal here is clogging up the under tray before pushing down... If that happens, then you have a binding you cannot lock in...!

Biggest failing point in my eyes, which then puts the whole project in doubt as if they don't lock down, or have issues due to conditions, then people will very quickly slate it...!

Get them out, the finished units, to as many people who can test in different conditions, including temps, as well as snow, and revisit next year is my suggestion, you may well end up not getting anywhere with this though...

Talking about temps, have you thought about moving parts and the testing it requires where for us, we have loads of the season at -20 and days as low as -30 Just curious, as everything works differently...!!! Even something as simple as using a go pro becomes hard work...!!! Batteries last a few minutes only... I have actually had boas freeze on me where it has been so cold they would not release... Only once, but was funny sitting in the car with the heater on to defrost them...!!!
08-28-2014 11:09 PM
Mizu Kuma Stone the crows, that's the third time this week!!!!!
This thread has more than 10 replies. Click here to review the whole thread.

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

 
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome