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  Topic Review (Newest First)
11-08-2011 04:47 PM
snowjeeper *facepalm*
11-08-2011 10:41 AM
david_z
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreampow View Post
Whether man made GW is true or not we should do all we can to live in a more sustainable way.
Absolutely. The problem is that so much unsustainable consumption has been effectively subsidized for years, encouraging habits that we would probably agree are detrimental to the planet/environment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dreampow View Post
It seems we all pretty much agree that science can be and is being warped to serve the people providing funding.
Check.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dreampow View Post
If mass media heavily push any dogma, idea or concept that is an immediate red light for me. That tells me there is probably a hidden agenda (usually money/control). Mass media is owned by the corporate elite of that there is no real doubt.
Mate.

I'm not saying that everything MSM reports is a lie, but there is good enough reason to at least be skeptical of whatever comes out of the corporate media's mouth holes. Corporate for-profit media will almost always repeat and propagates the ruling class' agenda/propaganda.
11-08-2011 10:38 AM
CheeseForSteeze
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreampow View Post
Whether man made GW is true or not we should do all we can to live in a more sustainable way.
It seems we all pretty much agree that science can be and is being warped to serve the people providing funding.
I know this can be true for pro and anti GW research alike.

With my background in science I am with the anti man made GW because I believe their argument to be much more sound and based on real data.

The video below doesn't show enough real data to make up your mind but you can look into any of the research in more detail and it makes sense (at least to me). Anyway the video will give you an idea of what they are saying.

The sun and its changes in activity correlates with changes in the earths temperature. Makes sense as its by far the most powerful and influential body in our solar system. The sun drives our planets warming and cooling as it goes through its own cycles in being more and less active.
This has a far bigger effect than the secondary effects of CO2 trapping more heat in our atmosphere. Lets not forget that the changes in CO2 levels here are in in a few parts per million. Also our targets to reduce CO2 are also in very few PPM. Don't you think an unimaginably huge explosion on the surface of the sun would have more effect on our weather than a tiny increase in CO2 which then traps more of that same suns energy in our atmosphere?


If mass media heavily push any dogma, idea or concept that is an immediate red light for me. That tells me there is probably a hidden agenda (usually money/control). Mass media is owned by the corporate elite of that there is no real doubt.


The taxpayers money to be spent on "green energy and initiatives" will be going into the coffers of the same people who control the media and have created the hysteria about GW.
The money will be in the form of contracts to build and implement these schemes which like hybrid cars are not really green.

If this money were really to be used efficiently to build a more sustainable society then I am for it.
Sadly I think that is just the facade that allows people to believe in man made GW.
Its a great way to get taxpayers to hand over more money and not question where its going.
"We have to do this or our planet will die".
This is more or less an accurate account of what is happening. For anyone to actually believe that there is enough computing power to build and run a model of global weather accurate enough to serve as even a reasonable facsimile, let alone predict the behavior of global temperatures to due to minute changes in aggregate atmospheric gaseous composition, you've used more drugs than Motley Crue did in the entire 80's.

There's nothing wrong with pushing for technology to live in a sustainable manner. But this alarmist Earth "The Day After Tomorrow" forecasting to pushing for global technology mandates which will cost untold trillions for some unquantified mitigation of said impending disaster is nothing more than feel-good propaganda to give people with no life some sort of purpose as well as a clever way to divert money into the coffers into people with a vested interest in emerging green technologies.
11-08-2011 10:31 AM
CheeseForSteeze
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThunderChunky View Post
That's a cause. It has become a different word because people manipulate it. IT literally just means what it says. Global Warming. But then again, I don't determine what is put in Websters Dictionary and I am certainly not an English professor.
So then what exactly is it you are confused about? No one disputes that global weather is a dynamic system. What is being disputed is how that system behaves if one where to change certain inputs.
11-08-2011 09:53 AM
dreampow Whether man made GW is true or not we should do all we can to live in a more sustainable way.
It seems we all pretty much agree that science can be and is being warped to serve the people providing funding.
I know this can be true for pro and anti GW research alike.

With my background in science I am with the anti man made GW because I believe their argument to be much more sound and based on real data.

The video below doesn't show enough real data to make up your mind but you can look into any of the research in more detail and it makes sense (at least to me). Anyway the video will give you an idea of what they are saying.

The sun and its changes in activity correlates with changes in the earths temperature. Makes sense as its by far the most powerful and influential body in our solar system. The sun drives our planets warming and cooling as it goes through its own cycles in being more and less active.
This has a far bigger effect than the secondary effects of CO2 trapping more heat in our atmosphere. Lets not forget that the changes in CO2 levels here are in in a few parts per million. Also our targets to reduce CO2 are also in very few PPM. Don't you think an unimaginably huge explosion on the surface of the sun would have more effect on our weather than a tiny increase in CO2 which then traps more of that same suns energy in our atmosphere?


If mass media heavily push any dogma, idea or concept that is an immediate red light for me. That tells me there is probably a hidden agenda (usually money/control). Mass media is owned by the corporate elite of that there is no real doubt.


The taxpayers money to be spent on "green energy and initiatives" will be going into the coffers of the same people who control the media and have created the hysteria about GW.
The money will be in the form of contracts to build and implement these schemes which like hybrid cars are not really green.

If this money were really to be used efficiently to build a more sustainable society then I am for it.
Sadly I think that is just the facade that allows people to believe in man made GW.
Its a great way to get taxpayers to hand over more money and not question where its going.
"We have to do this or our planet will die".


11-07-2011 08:53 PM
snowjeeper 604 you don't know what the shit you're talking about man.

The paper that the article mentions hasn't been published yet - but that's the point of their research, it was re-evaluating all of the numbers and methods that the previous research has done, and it validated all of it.

The Earth is getting warmer, fucking get used to it.
11-07-2011 08:36 PM
ThunderChunky That's a cause. It has become a different word because people manipulate it. IT literally just means what it says. Global Warming. But then again, I don't determine what is put in Websters Dictionary and I am certainly not an English professor.
11-07-2011 08:26 PM
CheeseForSteeze Global Warming refers to Human Induced Global Warming or Human Induced Global Climate Change.
11-07-2011 08:19 PM
ThunderChunky The earth is becoming warmer. It's literally not disputable. NASA and the Weather Channel both have records confirming it, along with any other record of world temperature. That's all global warming is right now, the earth becoming warmer. The theories surrounding the word are so large in numbers that Global Warming just means the earth becoming warmer.
11-07-2011 08:14 PM
HoboMaster I don't know, but the whole predicament is pretty hipster ironic. Activists and scientists have been trying to convince people of Global Warming for 20 years, and then now from what I'm hearing the same people are saying it's not real. Meanwhile all the G.O.P'ers and Corporate Whores who have denied climate change for no other reason then that it proves to be inconvenient, believe it's actually happening now.

All I know is that my major focuses partly on the aspects and science of GW, and the information I have been fed through a variety of classes makes it pretty apparent. Any way you want to speculate about it though, basic science says that when you put more greenhouse gases in the atmosphere, they reflect more thermal radiation back to the surface of the Earth which results in less net heat loss and a warmer surface; it's like a blanket. Incomplete combustion of fossil fuels adds more greenhouse gases to the atmosphere, the effect compounds itself, and tra la la.

Not totally sure how you debate against that, it's just a matter of simple principles.

Another interesting thing to note is people's perceptions of GW. Most people think of a Hollywood Version, in which the whole world increases in temperature equally, coastal towns become submerged, and no moar Polar Bears.

It doesn't work this way. Mostly what ends up happening is a noticeable increase in extremes between seasons. It depends on latitude, but for example most of the West will basically experience hotter dryer summers, and wetter warmer winters. This has pretty significant effects on both species adapted to living in the region and human processes (like agriculture) that rely on the current cycle.
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