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post #111 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-05-2014, 09:02 PM
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I agree with it if it's talking about xc, all mountain type flow trails. Disagree if it's talking about DH flow trails. Having a bunch of baby heads or roots at the base of a 10' drop could seriously fuck some people up....
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post #112 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-05-2014, 09:04 PM
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I agree to an extent. I do think there is one difference from mountain biking compared to skiing/snowboarding though, and that's that gracefully falling on a bike in choppy single track can be much harder if not impossible compared to falling on snow. I've killed myself on smooth green runs on snow don't get me wrong but I feel compltely comfortable falling on a snowboard all day long in most terrain. Falling on a bike still scares the sh*t out of me after years of riding. I'm no virgin to injuries but I wouldn't mind having a few less stitches, road rash, and broken bones that I've acquired from falling on some places green runs. I think most anybody can agree that mountain biking is far more intimidating than snowsports. Hell I've ridden plenty of singletrack that has rock gardens situated right next to a 30 foot cliff. That's not something every beginner should be subjected to, especially when many of these trails are in hidden logging lands, miles away from any way to get help or even simply to get back to your car.
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post #113 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-05-2014, 11:51 PM
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I agree whole heartedly with Argo and lab. MTB riding has the potential be a lot more hazardous than your average day boarding. I think there are two major issues with that article.

The first is if we are talking about resorts building trails? Well that's gonna be ALL about money. That pretty much goes without saying. Doesn't it? Am I shocked that they would build trails that are,... What? Family friendly? Mellow, easy green type trails? No. Do I think it's a bad idea? -meh- To use the snowboard analogy from earlier posts, You would think they would put in a few blue or even a black diamond trail or two like they do with their ski ops. But, even more so than with snowboarding, those trails would have a more limited appeal. Fewer ppl with the requisite skills to use them (...without dying that is!)

The second point,.. The trails I ride around here are in public city or state parks. They were built and for the most part maintained by local MTB clubs and organizations. Most of these single track trails have quite a wide range of technical difficulty. (... of course being in MI, they are not "downhill" big mountain type trails.)

Some of the more technical trails have even had obstacles added (...raised log rails or log and rock piles, etc.) usually well marked with signs showing the bypass routes to go around them.

So my point is, if the author wants more technical trails built? Get his club or group to build them. Of course The resort could build them. All they would need to do is clearly and carefuly mark the trails appropriately. Easy peezy!!

I'm not sure I see the problem. It should be easy to accomodate any and all skill levels!

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post #114 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 11:12 AM
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I am not even sure where this guy gets this idea. While certainly Beginner/Intermediate (especially intermediate) trails are the majority of the builds, I also see some pretty hard core trails going in. Black Jack at Buffalo Creek comes to mind. At Winterpark, they put in a new DH trail, that compares to any of the gnar at Whistler. My friend has the responsibility of giving the legalese okay to these trails for Intrawest in Colorado. He would not ride that line.

The fact of the matter too is most people like the intermediate trails. I know I fit squarely in that bunch and that is fine. I am also a more of a cross country guy than a DH dude. Kind of goes hand in hand with backcountry snowboarding. To suggest that Expert trails are not being built anymore is ridiculous. I also agree that a trail is what it is. Unless it has an inherent danger that is considered unreasonable, they should leave it alone. We have several where you have to portage your bikes for a small section or be really good at your technical skills. I haven't considered the thought of changing the trail to fit my needs. I can't do it, no shame in a short walk. Unless it is the walk of shame of course...

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post #115 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 11:32 AM
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Killclimbz,

I made the mistake of taking my hardtail XC bike on Blackjack at Buff Creek. No way I could ride that.. It was even hard walking some of it in hard soled MTB shoes..

Oh yeah, post my bikes:

1) a 1999 Litespeed titanium hardtail (serves as a commuter bike now 99% of time). all I need to do is swap out the tires and it can be ridden off road on Buff Creek type trails. Old style V-brakes and Shimano Deore XT. Nothing fancy. Beats the %^&* out of me on "real" trails. I once road this up and down the Barr Trail on Pikes peak, though- 8 hours of misery.

2) a 2007 Yeti ASR with Shimano XTR. This is my "real" mountain bike.

Last edited by deagol; 06-06-2014 at 11:39 AM.
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post #116 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 11:45 AM
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I definitely do not have the skills to do Blackjack. Walky, walky for me.
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post #117 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 12:06 PM
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I think maybe the articles author is just some curmudgeon looking to stir up controversy and get all the "haters" goin' off!

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post #118 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 01:01 PM
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I actually think he had some good points...
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post #119 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deagol View Post
I actually think he had some good points...
Yeah but they were really "moot points" IMO. Core riders aren't going to be the ones riding the DH "bunny trails" and as has been noted, (...by guys who ride these places & trails,) They are still building plenty of really technical trails to accommodate those "core" riders.

His point about asking "do we really want to get more people on MTB's?" And somehow linking that to the demise or "taming" of the technical side of the sport? That doesn't seem to be a valid point to me either.

I started out riding my MTB because it was a lower impact exercise with my arthritis. (...a fast paced walk of anything over 4-5 miles puts me in agony.) I started out just doing 10-15-20 miles of road riding on it, but gradually got more and more interested in the trail riding side! And while I'm not going to be rock hopping or riding log rails and dropping cliffs on gnarly DH runs, I have gotten more and more technical with my skills! (...we do have good sized hills to ride even here in S.E MI! Just not the, 5-8-10K vert. DH runs you guys r doing!)

It didn't take long before I wanted to learn more. Go faster into my turns! ...Ride harder, longer, steeper trails! So I would certainly presume that a great many people who might start out only doing those easy bunny trails, would eventually progress into wanting to ride more and more difficult, technical terrain. Thus creating a demand for more of those types of trails! Again,... Much like any Noob's progression with their snowboarding! (...Just Awesome how snowboarding anaologies fit so perfectly into many of life's situations and conundrums! Innit?)

Just my opinion, but there it is!!!





dammit! All this bike talk!! I need to get this back shit straightened out so I can get out on my bike again!!!!

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Last edited by chomps1211; 06-06-2014 at 02:03 PM.
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post #120 of 454 (permalink) Old 06-06-2014, 02:05 PM
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10k vert downhill? Where? Not in Colorado. I can think of several that are between 1 and 2k. Maybe a ski area has one around 4k but there are not many.
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