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Old 03-05-2014, 08:05 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Not all gore-tex is made equal?

I was under the impression that apparel companies buy the gore-tex pro shell fabric from gore-tex themselves. How is it possible I've had varying success with different companies even tho the material should be similar?

Anyhoo, a few reviews

Oakley Sethmo pants - goretex proshell. These tore on the second day of wearing them, and I don't even know how as I never went through any trees or hit anything other than snow. My friend has the oakley unification pro proshell pants and the material on it is outrageously thin. I would stay away from anything Oakley makes that incorporates gore-tex proshell. I still have these own these pants as anything with holes or tears becomes more difficult to sell. Bought these for $100 off whiskeymilitia a few years back.

Oakley great ascent pants - goretex??? . These pants are advertised as goretex but the membrane feels like oakley's other stuff. It isn't terribly waterproof and its insulated. Regardless, its a nice, durable pant to say the least. Don't know what exactly about it is gore-tex. I bought these off hautelook for $80 bucks.

Burton AK-2L Stagger jacket - Piece of shit jacket. There's a lining on the front pocket that is causing abrasion against the gore-tex fabric thus cutting a hole into it. The lettering and logos arefalling off. For top of the line apparel, I expected more. I've had only ten days on these! I just sent them to Burton today for warranty. Bought off craigslist for $100

Burton AK-3L skid hi-top - amazing pants, I rode two seasons in these and nothing but slight abrasion wear.
Burton AK 3L Skid Hi-Top Pant - Men's - 09/10 | Backcountry.com
Bought these pants off sierrasnowboard back in the day for $140. Sold these pants cuz they were ugly but somewhat regret it.

Bottom line, I would only buy burton ak 3 layered stuff, otherwise just stick with normal burton gear.

Arc'teryx Scorpion jacket - goretex softshell. Of all the goretex apparel i've owned, this is by far the most durable. I've owned this for 5 seasons and continue wearing it to this day for both riding and climbing excursions - though it gets a little hot for the summers. I believe this jacket was replaced by either the Stingray or Sabre model. This jacket...was expensive - even when Arc'teryx is on sale its still very expensive.

Arc'teryx Beta AR - goretex proshell. I have not tested it as I bought this shell specifically for outdoor climbing and camping excursions. The material seems at least as durable as the burton 3L pants I had however, and definitely miles apart from the Oakley goretex stuff I've had.
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Old 03-05-2014, 10:49 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Nice rant but I love my oakley goretex. Its light, flexible, warm and waterproof as f#ck.
Yes I do have 2 small cuts in it in 60+ days riding but both are from hard contact with a sharp snowboard edge, shit happens when you ride hard. I got over it pretty fast.
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Old 03-06-2014, 02:05 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I am no expert here at all, but my wife knows quite a bit about fabrics.

To answer the question the gore tex seems to be the water proof membrane in between the fabrics. The fabric on either side of the membrane varies from brand to brand and within the brand according to price, even the top of the line stuff gore tex pro is made with different fabrics from Patagonia to Oakley to Burton etc.

Find the best brand for you and enjoy.

I doubt many fabrics would survive ETMs edge, I am goofy hes regular, this Feb we somehow got back to back in a tree run and collided. I bounced of him and ate shit and he didn't even notice the collision.
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Old 03-06-2014, 02:09 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I doubt many fabrics would survive ETMs edge, I am goofy hes regular, this Feb we somehow got back to back in a tree run and collided. I bounced of him and ate shit and he didn't even notice the collision.
Haha thats a camp fire story dreampow.
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Old 03-06-2014, 05:18 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreampow View Post
I am no expert here at all, but my wife knows quite a bit about fabrics.

To answer the question the gore tex seems to be the water proof membrane in between the fabrics. The fabric on either side of the membrane varies from brand to brand and within the brand according to price, even the top of the line stuff gore tex pro is made with different fabrics from Patagonia to Oakley to Burton etc.
I don't think the above is true:

Our Fabrics - GORE-TEX® Products

It also seems that in given years all the pro shell stuff comes in only a few colours. I think that's because goretex only does certain colours each year.

So I think goretex is goretex, regardless off brand, bearing in mind that they make different fabrics, proshell, soft shell etc.
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Old 03-06-2014, 06:06 AM   #6 (permalink)
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My Burton Stagger 2L pants and jacket have been fucking fantastic and more durable then I would have ever guessed.
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Old 03-06-2014, 07:22 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Arc'teryx Beta AR - goretex proshell. I have not tested it as I bought this shell specifically for outdoor climbing and camping excursions. The material seems at least as durable as the burton 3L pants I had however, and definitely miles apart from the Oakley goretex stuff I've had.
I have this jacket, and I'm convinced that the outer shell fabric saved me from a potentially nasty injury a couple weeks ago. Basically I was dived bombed from behind by a noob that didn't know how to stop. As he took my legs out from under me and fell himself, my forearm landed perpendicular to his snowboard edge, which was pointing upward as he landed on his back. Hurt like hell. I figured for sure my jacket was ripped and figured at least somewhat of a cut on my arm. Nope, the jacket didn't even register a slight mark from that impact even though I developed a baseball-sized bruise on my forearm where it landed. Shit was like armor.
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Old 03-06-2014, 07:35 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Lamps View Post
I don't think the above is true:

Our Fabrics - GORE-TEX® Products

It also seems that in given years all the pro shell stuff comes in only a few colours. I think that's because goretex only does certain colours each year.

So I think goretex is goretex, regardless off brand, bearing in mind that they make different fabrics, proshell, soft shell etc.
lamps i believe dreampow's wife is correct. goretex is a membrane in between fabrics and then there's a waterproof coating of some sorts on the outside of the fabric. But the membrane is the key ingredient with goretex products. I could be wrong, of course.
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Old 03-06-2014, 07:51 AM   #9 (permalink)
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How that membrane is encased and what it is encased with determines the difference in durabilty and breatheability I believe. I could be wrong, but I think the Gore-tex membrane itself is the same from product to product (as you guys are saying here) but from a consumer's perspective I still think it holds that not all Gore-tex is the same.

Here's an example of some of the differences from the Arc'Teryx website:
GORE-TEX® Guide / Arc'teryx
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Old 03-06-2014, 08:13 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by trapper View Post
How that membrane is encased and what it is encased with determines the difference in durabilty and breatheability I believe. I could be wrong, but I think the Gore-tex membrane itself is the same from product to product (as you guys are saying here) but from a consumer's perspective I still think it holds that not all Gore-tex is the same.

Here's an example of some of the differences from the Arc'Teryx website:
GORE-TEX® Guide / Arc'teryx
If you look at the fabrics they mention, eg goretex active, that is a goretex fabrics, listed on the goretex website.

Goretex says on their website:

"What is GORE-TEXfabric?
First introduced in 1978, GORE-TEX fabric is created when we laminate our patentedGORE-TEX membrane to high-performance textiles, which are then used by authorized garment manufacturers to make outerwear, accessories, and footwear."

I think that goretex doesn't sell the membrane seperately, probably to ensure that there are no quality issues. Eg someone laminates the membrane into a poor quality fabric or glues it in a way that hurts the performance and then the end user blames goretex for performance issues.

It might be that arcteryx for example gets special fabric but I don't think so since the fabrics on their site are named as goretex products by goretex, not just the membrane.

I'm sure oakley or burton or arcteryx would like consumers to think their fabric is superior to others but I'm pretty certain it's not, the difference is in features and sewing etc. Noting of course that goretex makes different grades of fabric.

Last edited by Lamps; 03-06-2014 at 08:24 AM.
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