FlexMeter Demon wrist guards?? Or what are "better" wrist guards out there? - Page 2 - Snowboarding Forum - Snowboard Enthusiast Forums
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post #11 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Enigmatic View Post
However, according to Level's marketing/research, you increase the risk of breaking your wrist 3 inches up your radius/ulna
No.

This conclusion is based on inadequate "research" on inline skaters, not snowboarders, and wasn't done by Level. They just referenced the "old wives' tale" from the study above.
Go to Welcome to the all-new www.ski-injury.com! The number 1 site in Google for snow sports safety - Ski Injury for the explanation from a U.K. doctor who focuses on these types of injuries.

To the OP, I wear the Flexmeter guards. To me, they offer the best protection of any snowboard wrist guard available. You don't need the double-sided model for snowboarding, but if you really want the extra protection on the palm side, be aware that you will need larger gloves to fit over them. You can also buy the gloves with the (removable) protection built in to avoid this.

I know that the Level gloves are quite popular, but I don't understand how they protect your wrist from hyperflexion, which is the injury that occurs in snowboarding.

I definitely recommend the flexmeters.

Last edited by GreyDragon; 02-26-2013 at 02:16 AM.
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post #12 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 02:25 AM
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Yeah I'm a bit skeptical about level's research myself. They aren't exactly, totally clear about how biomex prevents hyperextension but here's what they did say: "BIOMEX ( fig.5) is the only wrist guard that keeps the wrist in an anatomically strong position, where muscle-forces and bone congruency combine to provide optimum stability without compromising the freedom to move."

It almost sounds a bit BS'y to me but I suppose what they're trying to say (with the accompanying picture on the site) is that the shape, contour, and hold of the glove keeps your hand in a position that disperses the energy from a fall across a greater number of paths or directions of your forearm. Whereas, traditional guards prevent a break at the wrist but then divert all the force into one direction (at the top of the guard, causing a slightly more proximal fracture). Your link's doctor found 2 snowboarders who had this type of injury, definitely not a very large number.

The Level site says "The effectiveness of wrist guards was demonstrated in a 4 year study conducted by the St.Moritz Orthopaedic Hospital, Klinic Gut The study involved over 40,000 snowboard hours and more than 2400 participants. The results of the study showed that the likelihood of a wrist injury is reduced 4.5 times using conventional wristgurads. With Biomex wristguards, the risk of injury is reduced 7.5 times."

No mention of any actual research article with a detailed methods section so its not clear if the conventional wristguard people had this "higher up wive's tale" fracture or not but I guess that's to be presumed based on the numbers?

Then again, I've never met anyone whose broken the upper part of their wrist while wearing traditional wrist guards. And come to think of it, I only have one friend who snapped his wrist supperr gnarly falling off a rail. Could all be a marketing scheme/over-exaggeration... Based off the link you posted, it seems the wrist guards to definitely not wear are the short, rigid traditional skating ones. I wouldn't have imagined someone could snap both their radius and ulna directly under a guard like that until seeing that pic.

I dunno, but I do know I've taken a ton of pretty nasty falls, straight to my hands, and never even sprained my wrists. So that's why I keep going back to level, and also because the glove itself is pretty awesome as well (and especially because I keep somehow finding great deals on them...)

Last edited by Enigmatic; 02-26-2013 at 02:59 AM.
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post #13 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 05:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigmatic View Post
The Level site says "The effectiveness of wrist guards was demonstrated in a 4 year study conducted by the St.Moritz Orthopaedic Hospital, Klinic Gut The study involved over 40,000 snowboard hours and more than 2400 participants. The results of the study showed that the likelihood of a wrist injury is reduced 4.5 times using conventional wristgurads. With Biomex wristguards, the risk of injury is reduced 7.5 times."
If anything, the above quote, corroborated by the "ski injury" website, points out that wearing ANY wrist guard is better than not wearing any for minimizing wrist injuries while snowboarding.

To be clear, I'm not saying that the Level guards don't work. I just don't see how they prevent/reduce hyperflexion. Interestingly, the "ski injury" website indicates that the protection should be on the back of the hand to prevent/minimize hyperflexion. This makes sense to me and why I like the flexmeters. However, the same site recommends two guards - Flexmeter and Level!

I think I"ll send an e-mail to the site asking about that.
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post #14 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 09:50 AM Thread Starter
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Found myself reading thru ski-injury articles for the past 2 hours lol.
Still have lots to read but this defiantly got my attention:

Quote:
...studies that have been performed in this area are a bit bizarre – basically taking both arms off dead people, fitting one of them with a guard and leaving the other without and then seeing how much force it takes to break each wrist by simulating a fall. Four studies have now shown that, in the wrist with the guard on, one way or another more energy is needed to cause a fracture and that the fractures that do eventually occur are of a reduced severity. So now you know what really happens when you leave your body to medical science…
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post #15 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 10:15 AM
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LOL!
Yes, that one caught my eye when I first read it.

Also, if you like riding the park, don't go to the section on Terrain Parks. Nothing gruesome, but the stats might make you think a few times about riding the park, and the intelligence of the designers.

BTW, I sent an e-mail to Welcome to the all-new www.ski-injury.com! The number 1 site in Google for snow sports safety - Ski Injury this morning, asking about the Biomex (Level) protection. I'll pass on what I get back.
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post #16 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 10:53 AM
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FlexMeter Demon wrist guards?? Or what are "better" wrist guards out there?

burton makes some that are great. not to rigid but gives the top of your hand a lot of support as to not hurt your forearm or elbow. the construction isn't the best though.
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post #17 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 12:38 PM
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I have been using these for a few years now and liked them so much I bought another pair.

Triple Eight Snow Underglove Wrist Guards (Pair)
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post #18 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 12:44 PM
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I just found/picked up a pair of level half-pipe mitts (goretex) for $56 shipped, on eBay. So stoked... thanks for this thread haha, wouldn't have been stimulated to look without it
Damn you. I really wanted mitts. Originally ordered mitts but they sent gloves because mitts were out of stock. Offered me a nice little discount to keep the gloves so I did. Still wish I had mitts though.
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post #19 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 12:49 PM
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No.

This conclusion is based on inadequate "research" on inline skaters, not snowboarders, and wasn't done by Level. They just referenced the "old wives' tale" from the study above.
No.

"The effectiveness of wrist guards was demonstrated in a 4 year study conducted by the St.Moritz Orthopaedic Hospital, Klinic Gut The study involved over 40,000 snowboard hours and more than 2400 participants. "

Quote directly from Level's site. Are you implying that Level is being deceptive?

Edit: Just noticed Enigmatic posted the same quote earlier.

Last edited by rfrich74; 02-26-2013 at 12:52 PM. Reason: Reading fail
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post #20 of 125 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 01:41 PM
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"Don't wrist guards lead to injury further up the arm?

O.M.G!!! This is an old chestnut with very little actual basis in fact but it still rears its ugly head far too frequently! In 1995 (15+ years ago now), Cheng et al reported four cases where skaters (not snowboarders) wearing wrist guards sustained open forearm fractures immediately proximal to the wrist guard. They hypothesised that the guard could transfer the energy of impact from the hand to the mid-forearm level. Their report did not describe the splints each individual was using or if they were fitted properly. Whilst it may sound a cautionary note, very few other case reports have been forthcoming out of the many thousands of skating injuries occurring every year.

You also have to remember that inline skating and snowboarding are different sports. Skaters usually fall onto concrete surfaces (consequently with a more abrupt stop involved). I am only aware of two individual cases where snowboarders wearing guards have sustained upper arm fractures, possibly as a result of wearing a guard. This must be compared to the thousands of potential wrist injuries that guards have prevented or reduced in severity. Subsequent biomechanical studies do not support Cheng’s theory and, in fact, demonstrate that one of the protective effects of guards is to dissipate impact energy safely throughout the device without increasing the forces at any one spot."


Quoted from www.ski-injury.com, a site that does not sell ANY brand of wrist guard, unlike Level.

The line you quote references numbers for the reduction of wrist injuries from wearing wrist guards (including Level) versus not wearing any wrist guards. It does not specifically give evidence of fractures "moving up" the arm where a wrist guard ends.
From Level's website: "Standard wrist guards frequently push the fracture farther up the forearm". Well, how frequently? If they can give specific ratios for improvement in wrist injury reduction from their study, they should be able to provide similar numbers for the claim about injuries moving up the forearm. Notably, they don't.

And yes, the original quote is to what I was referring in my post that you reference.

Last edited by GreyDragon; 02-26-2013 at 03:06 PM.
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