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post #21 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-04-2010, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Snowolf View Post
Dude, when I read this I wonder if we live in the same country or reality...
My brother went to live in the US a number of years ago. He came back for a visit recently, and he really opened my eyes about how possible it is to be totally... uh... there are no words...

Did you know that Obama is a muslim and was not born in the US (that's an easy one, but was just the opening salvo). Did you know that Bush is actually a much better speaker, much more erudite than Obama? Yeah, without his teleprompter Obama is inarticulate, whereas Bush can improvise Shakespeare. Did you know that the 2008 financial crisis was actually caused by Clinton-era policies? Of course, there's also the standards -- GW is a consipracy, there is no mid-pacific sargasso, it's all made up by intullectools, etc.

I think everyone's missed a very basic point -- it is just possible that US-style conservatisim *isn't* a mental illness. It may actually be a *virus*!


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post #22 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-04-2010, 05:53 PM
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Dude, when I read this I wonder if we live in the same country or reality...

Not ragging on you at all here, just trying to see where you come by this perspective.

For my part, I saw Obama as bending over backwards to the point of alienating the very liberal base who got him elected in an attempt to work with Republicans. At every turn, all I have seen from my perspective, is Republicans spitting in his face and stabbing him in the back. I have gotten really pissed at Obama`s cow towing to Republicans in the house and senate.

You bring up partisan politics, yet that is exactly what I see these Republicans doing. They use house rules to play games to stop debate on every bill brought up for vote on the floor. I watch this shit on C Span and all I see is negative bullshit from these Republicans to kill everything while offering nothing of their own.

Like, I said, not jumping your shit here, I just am truly shocked that you see thing this way and am very curious as to how you come by this opinion....
Let me be clear, I was not saying the republicans don't play partisan politics, am just saying I expected O'bama to rise above that (that is what he promised in his campaign) and from my stand point he did not. For instance the health care bill, one of the key sticking points was tort reform. The first bill didn't have this in there at all. How could that be left out when frivolous lawsuits are one of the things pushing cost up. They then put some tort reform but was watered down from what the republicans would have wanted, then I think it may have been taken out and put back in again, ultimately I don't know what happened in the end things change so much with that bill. Part of comprimising with the other party is including things that are part of their agenda in the legislation. Right at the start of administration they Obama people started the crap with saying Rush was the leader of the republican party... I know it seems trivial but in my opinion this is not the way to start out when running on platform of change and a promise to promote bi partisan politics.

Regardless of party, in my life time successfully presidents (only one Bill Clinton) successfully worked with the opposition, when this happened things went good for the country. It seems when one party has control of executive branch and legislative branch an important check and balance is removed from the process. That is why I voted the way I did. It maybe different than what you think, but what you think is necssarly the rule, neither is what I think.....

Maybe nothing will get done, maybe some of the best legislation this country has seen will be passed, but for that to happen the President and Legislative branch are going to have work together.


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Last edited by kysnowboarder; 11-04-2010 at 05:59 PM. Reason: add
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post #23 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-04-2010, 06:31 PM
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Obama in my opinion has risen above partisan politics. he wasted months of time trying to bring them to the table on health care and other big legislation pieces and they were just wasting his time. they adopted a strategy of opposing everything he proposed regardless of what it is. Its funny because they actually even went so far in many cases as to oppose things they themselves had originally proposed just because he was willing to compromise on them.

Anybody who thinks that Obama has governed as a far left ideologue unwilling to come to the middle has been watching too much fox news. because Obama has pretty much governed from the middle. for heavens sake; the entire health care bill is built on ideas that guys like Bob Dole and John McCain originally brought to the table years ago. If it was far left he would have dissolved the entire insurance industries and told all their employees they were now gov't workers and everybody in the nation would be on medicare.
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post #24 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-04-2010, 08:36 PM
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You think that abortion of a health care bill was playing the middle? Seriously?!
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post #25 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-04-2010, 08:43 PM
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absolutely. In comparison to Bill Clinton's health care proposal it was conservative. Liberal would have been medicare for all . which by the way is what almost every industrialized country in the world has had for decades.
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post #26 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 11:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowolf View Post
And herein lies the problem. I see Obama as having risen above this and trying more than any president. Certainly George W. Bush did not even try to even act like he was trying to work with Democrats. Obama has, in my opinion done this; it is the Republicans who have refuse to work with him.

This election will take the very situation you are concerned about and make it even worse.

As for the tort reform issue, this is a real misnomer. So called frivolous lawsuits are a very, very minor contributor to rising health care costs. The Tort reforms wanted by Republicans would have made it virtually impossible for victims of real malpractice to seek and receive compensation for gross negligence. I supported the Democrats for not backing down on this. Like most things Republican, it was a blank pardon for big HMO`s and drug companies who's products kill and injure people.

Here is an interesting article from a medical journal that talks about tort reform and how the GOP is overstating the issue for political gain....

tort-reform-unlikely-to-cut-health-care-costs

I totally understand your points and could even side with them if I thought your perception was accurate. I don't and as before, I am at a loss to understand how we can both look at the same events and come up with such drastic differences in what we perceived.
I am pretty sure the comments about rush (who I dislike very strongly and is probably the biggest hypocrite this country has ever known, I can't believe anyone still listens to his show)and the republican leadership were made by O'bama's press secretary to the press. I wouldn't have given any stock other wise. If law suits are not a huge problem than how can the large malpractice policies be explained? Do we really have that many in competent doctors?

At any rate, even if I am wrong on both of these points, I will never support one party rule, I just don't believe the other side is totally wrong and has nothing to give.


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post #27 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 11:41 AM
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Why are Americans so trigger happy with lawsuits? I worked for a Canadian company dealing with Americans and dealt with legal threats on a daily basis. Most of it was just talk anyways, but you don't need to sue my pants off every time, just ask!

"I have a lawyer!"

Yea everyone and their dogs have a lawyer, the difference is ours be corporate and we'd counter for your house

Did she say Strap-in or Strap-on?
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post #28 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 11:49 AM
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why the fuck are you calling President Obama "O'bama" ?? is that some dumbass redneck joke from Kentucky i don't get or are you just ignorant?

oh, wait... you live in Kentucky and voted Republican..... yea you're just ignorant
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post #29 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 11:50 AM
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Because, Americans don't know how to work things out. They only know how to force people in order to get what they want.

PowderHound and TreeNinja
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post #30 of 76 (permalink) Old 11-07-2010, 11:55 AM
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lol i read in the paper a while back about "Obama Baby Mama Drama"

you people, hah, love it

Did she say Strap-in or Strap-on?
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