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Old 11-18-2011, 01:49 AM   #41 (permalink)
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Let's keep the distinction clear. If you elect republican, they will legislate to shift the tax burden onto the poor. If you elect democrats, they will shift the tax burden back to the wealthy, as it had been and should be. So you're either for increasing economic inequality (republican) or against it (democrat).
You sure about that?



Now, this can be argued it is due to the income disparity, and that may be very well true, but the burden has shifted from the poor to the rich. If you want it more equal, you will necessarily have to shift the tax burden back to the less than rich.
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Old 11-18-2011, 02:09 AM   #42 (permalink)
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You guys want a reason to vote Republican? Look how fucked up California is. Ran by Democrats, when the whole nation went right in the 2010 midterms California inexplicably went even further left.

Put this in your pipe and smoke it. We used to be the 5th largest economy in the world. Last count we're now 8th. And I shudder to think where we are now. Our roads are shit. I go to Texas, Colorado, AZ and in the larger cities the roads so far are pristine. Our roads are fucked up in all of the major cities.

With the 8th largest economy in the WORLD we spend 49th most in the nation on Education. Where the fuck is all our money going? Even that, we're perennially in the red with deficit spending up the yin yang.

Why is California's unemployment rate 3 points higher than the rest of the nation? Because we have attracted no business investment since 2000. Businesses are fleeing our state. We are ran by Democrats. Read this unbiased article (no mention of any party) to see the numbers and facts about our plight.

The Long Stall by Wendell Cox, City Journal Autumn 2011

#2 reason to vote Republican. Barack Obama. Guy is terrible. He is perfect for Congress. He should have stayed there. He's a terrible leader. He had no executive experience and it showed. He's real smart but you don't need someone smart, you can surround yourself with smart people. Jimmy Carter's intelligence was touted. Look what happened there. John Kerry was supposed to be smarter than George Bush but nobody ever told us Kerry's grades were worse than Bush's. But we heard ad nausea about Bush's grades. Higher intelligence in the Oval Office is vastly overrated.

Snowolf, I think that Reagan clip shows how he would fit right in with this current GOP. He called for a closing of loopholes while also calling for a lower tax rate which we got. He worked with Congress for bipartisan solutions. That's exactly what Paul Ryan proposed earlier this year with his budget proposal where he said let's close loopholes and then lower the tax rates down to 25%. That would be revenue neutral. Reagan lowered the top rates from 70% down to the 30's. He's very much in line with the tea party. Reagan closed loopholes, lowered rates, and eliminated a lot of rampant tax shelters.

By the way, what Obama wants is not a closing of "loopholes' It's just a tax surcharge. Huge difference. It's just a higher rate.

A loophole would be the current rule where a hedge fund manager can make millions but only pay capital gains taxes (15%) by classifying it as carried interest. That is a loophole. And that should be closed. They should pay ordinary income rates, same as everyone else.

Also note that Buffett himself disagrees with the Buffett rule.

Quote:
Some guy making 50 million here playing baseball, his taxes won't change. Make $50 million a year appearing on television, his income won't change. But if they make a lot of money and they pay a very low tax rate, like me, it would be changed by a minimum tax that would only bring them up to what the other people pay."
The Buffett rule proposed by Obama just raises taxes on everyone over $1 million. Much further than what Buffett and Reagan called for.


Reagan is definitely more pragmatic than currently portrayed however. Many things he did defy his conservative image portrayed today. He just got shit done. IF you think about it him and Clinton are quite similar. Someone (maybe it was Maddow)called Clinton out for kowtowing to the Conservatives. Because a bunch of shit he did was Conservative as well. He shot back, that he just got shit done. He doesn't care about left/right when youre leading. You just did what you need to do for the people.

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Old 11-18-2011, 05:18 AM   #43 (permalink)
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So lets get this straight...if you vote against Obama to support the Republican candidate then you are a fucking moron???
Yeah, for anyone who's been paying attention, this sums it up pretty well.

How someone can equate politicians advocating a step to the left with those taking a leap to the right baffles me.
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:23 AM   #44 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jdang307 View Post
You sure about that?



Now, this can be argued it is due to the income disparity, and that may be very well true, but the burden has shifted from the poor to the rich. If you want it more equal, you will necessarily have to shift the tax burden back to the less than rich.
This doesn't tell the story of income distribution and how a marginalized lower class is too broke to pay taxes. If you've been paying attention to the supercommitte proceedings then you'd see that shifting the tax burden onto the wealthy isn't even a consideration. But shifting the cost burden onto the poor through austerity measures are.
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Old 11-18-2011, 05:33 AM   #45 (permalink)
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Here are a few good pieces detailing the egregious changes in republican tax policy over the last few decades. This is the reason we shouldn't have been voting for republicans for the last 30 years.

How the GOP Became the Party of the Rich | Politics News | Rolling Stone

Tim Dickinson: The Tax Policies That Increased Economic Inequality : NPR

Can We Blame Income Inequality on Republicans? - Slate Magazine

The Tiabbi piece is superb as always.
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Old 11-18-2011, 11:20 AM   #46 (permalink)
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Here's a good reason to vote Republican:

You voted Republican and they ruined the country.

You voted Democrat and they didn't fix everything overnight.

So you vote Republican again because you, like the rest of the country, have the memory span of a fucking goldfish, and because you, like the rest of the country, are convinced we live in a two party system.

And finally, you vote Republican because they say they won't raise your taxes because 'taxes stifle growth'. Nevermind that taxes are the lowest they've been in decades and nobody's asking the Republicans 'We are and have been trying it your way, where's the fucking growth?' because you're a schmuck and think 'Hey, less taxes means more money in my pocket.' while giving no consideration to how they'll just take the money out of your pocket other ways, like welfare cuts, education cuts, tuition increases... and my favorite: removing the health insurance mandate, so my insurance company has to pay the medical bills for all the fat uninsured midwest heart-attack Wal-Mart shopping fuckers who claimed bankruptcy when they had their quadruple bypass surgery.

God, I LOVE it when my premium increases because I have to pay for Billy Bob's angioplasty.
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Old 11-18-2011, 03:39 PM   #47 (permalink)
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The seeds placed by Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton caused the financial crisis. That is fact. Wall Street injected steroids, yes. But Govt. supplied the steroids.

The financial crisis doesn't happen unless Bill Clinton pushes major home ownership throughout the 90's.

The housing crisis doesn't happen without Clinton. Wall Street piled on with the derivatives, credit default swaps, etc. yes. But those are derivatives of the subprime mortgages that Clinton forced through.

What was it like pre-Reagan I might ask everyone. Everyone keeps saying Republicans ruined our nation. Are you guys too young to remember the 70's. Snowolf you were quite young then but do you remember how it was before Republicans.

I ask, if Republicans were so bad, are all of you guys clamoring for the 70's again???

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Old 11-18-2011, 04:11 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Yes, the 70's were better than things are right now. But no we need to move forward from a corporate government, regardless of party.
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:26 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Yes, the 70's were better than things are right now. But no we need to move forward from a corporate government, regardless of party.
By what measure are the 70's better than they are now.

Yes we do need to move forward from a corporate government, but that is a pipe dream unless we ban lobbying which would be unconstitutional.

Some sort of cap on campaign finance would work
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Old 11-18-2011, 04:54 PM   #50 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdang307 View Post
The seeds placed by Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton caused the financial crisis. That is fact. Wall Street injected steroids, yes. But Govt. supplied the steroids.

The financial crisis doesn't happen unless Bill Clinton pushes major home ownership throughout the 90's.

The housing crisis doesn't happen without Clinton. Wall Street piled on with the derivatives, credit default swaps, etc. yes. But those are derivatives of the subprime mortgages that Clinton forced through.

What was it like pre-Reagan I might ask everyone. Everyone keeps saying Republicans ruined our nation. Are you guys too young to remember the 70's. Snowolf you were quite young then but do you remember how it was before Republicans.

I ask, if Republicans were so bad, are all of you guys clamoring for the 70's again???
You should really read the articles I posted.
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