Gun Control Debate thread

[Donutz]

Originally Posted by sleev-les

Mass shootings are still few and you again stated that they still happen, but are few in places even with more strict laws.

Sleev-les, just to clarify: one of the original intents of this thread was to deal with the fact that mass shootings are far higher in the USA than anywhere else. There's a reason for that, and we'd like to know what it is. More gun control is an obvious and facile solution, and people on your end of the political spectrum are very quick to point that out, and to point out that the second amendment is a right, and to point out any misc statistics, rail against suggested gun bans (even if they weren't suggested), etc etc etc. But that's where it ends. You couldn't seem to care less what the real reason is, don't seem to make any effort at all to look into it. As long as your precious gun rights are preserved, all is ok. I think that's what really pisses people off about people who are taking your side of the debate.

[sleev-les]

Originally Posted by Donutz

Sleev-les, just to clarify: one of the original intents of this thread was to deal with the fact that mass shootings are far higher in the USA than anywhere else. There's a reason for that, and we'd like to know what it is. More gun control is an obvious and facile solution, and people on your end of the political spectrum are very quick to point that out, and to point out that the second amendment is a right, and to point out any misc statistics, rail against suggested gun bans (even if they weren't suggested), etc etc etc. But that's where it ends. You couldn't seem to care less what the real reason is, don't seem to make any effort at all to look into it. As long as your precious gun rights are preserved, all is ok. I think that's what really pisses people off about people who are taking your side of the debate.

The real reason? How about the individual and his will to do harm?! I do care what the real reason is, which is why I stand behind gun rights and trying to stay optimistic even while seeing our politicians clawing at this recent event to serve some political agenda. That is a tragedy in and of itself. Too many are quick to blame a gun for an individuals act. To blame a gun is what truly highlights your statement about not caring about the real reason. A gun is not what causes someone to go on a rampage. Something else altogether causes that. When someone (and I've seen it posted before in other threads) says a comment such as forks are making people fat, lets ban them. You are quick to pick that apart and say its not relevant to the argument. THE ROOT CAUSE is the individual so stop blaming the tools. Yet me mentioning other opportunities for these acts to occur (and even posted a story) you again pick that apart and try to believe its not possible or wouldn't happen if a gun isn't available. I'll say it again, use the proper tools to limit the risk. Stop with the gung ho hardcore stance and look at real methods to help keep guns out of the individuals hands that have the potential to do harm. (class, psych eval, permit renewal etc etc).

[Edge]

You are kind of getting into the territory that America just happens to have more crazy people per capita.

And that's completely untrue. There is a reason that more massacres occur in the US is obvious.

[sleev-les]

Originally Posted by Edge

You are kind of getting into the territory that America just happens to have more crazy people per capita.

And that's completely untrue. There is a reason that more massacres occur in the US is obvious.

Can you ellaborate? Just curious what your thoughts on this are.

[Edge]

Originally Posted by sleev-les

Can you ellaborate? Just curious what your thoughts on this are.

What I mean to say is, you are speaking as if the problem was just with psychopaths. But every nation has mental cases that would commit these atrocities.

Then we see that it happens a LOT more often in the US than elsewhere. So logic dictates that the reason must be either..

a) America is generating a larger ratio of mental cases.

or

b) There is a major difference between America and other countries that makes committing these atrocities more common.


A) seems very unlikely. Mental issues are exactly that, mental, and the number of crazies in the population will be pretty balanced all over the world.

So that leaves B). Now B) doesn't necessary mean it's because guns are massively easy to obtain compared to the rest of the world, but that's the biggest possibility. Whether it is a lack of gun control or something else, we need to find what it is, and eliminate the problem.

[sleev-les]

Originally Posted by Edge

What I mean to say is, you are speaking as if the problem was just with psychopaths. But every nation has mental cases that would commit these atrocities.

Then we see that it happens a LOT more often in the US than elsewhere. So logic dictates that the reason must be either..

a) America is generating a larger ratio of mental cases.

or

b) There is a major difference between America and other countries that makes committing these atrocities more common.


A) seems very unlikely. Mental issues are exactly that, mental, and the number of crazies in the population will be pretty balanced all over the world.

So that leaves B). Now B) doesn't necessary mean it's because guns are massively easy to obtain compared to the rest of the world, but that's the biggest possibility. Whether it is a lack of gun control or something else, we need to find what it is, and eliminate the problem.

This is just my opinion and you may call me crazy for thinking so, but the US has a strange breed of mental, in many different definitions. I think in recent we have seen more people snap because of economic issues, leading those that were good to go way out to left field and the part I'll probably get some flack on is that 21 December is coming up (this is only for the elevated recent events) and I thnk some of these people are truly convinced its the end of the world causing them to snap or at least go public with there issues thinking they have nothing to lose. I travel a lot and can definitely see the US is an odd breed. For a lot of people, they do not know how to handle lesser times and they can't cope.

[Edge]

Originally Posted by sleev-les

This is just my opinion and you may call me crazy for thinking so, but the US has a strange breed of mental, in many different definitions. I think in recent we have seen more people snap because of economic issues, leading those that were good to go way out to left field and the part I'll probably get some flack on is that 21 December is coming up (this is only for the elevated recent events) and I thnk some of these people are truly convinced its the end of the world causing them to snap or at least go public with there issues thinking they have nothing to lose. I travel a lot and can definitely see the US is an odd breed. For a lot of people, they do not know how to handle lesser times and they can't cope.

I won't every attack anyone for having an opinion, but honestly, I can see your perspective. America has a lot of extremists, whether they are religious, political, or social. But realistically, I too have spent a lot of my short life travelling, and I can happily say that America has it easy. You're hardly living in a third world country. If it was just "The End of The World," it wouldn't have been going on for so long. There is another reason at work here, I really can't see the reason for all these massacres as "America generates more psycopaths."

[sleev-les]

Originally Posted by Edge

I won't every attack anyone for having an opinion, but honestly, I can see your perspective. America has a lot of extremists, whether they are religious, political, or social. But realistically, I too have spent a lot of my short life travelling, and I can happily say that America has it easy. You're hardly living in a third world country. If it was just "The End of The World," it wouldn't have been going on for so long. There is another reason at work here, I really can't see the reason for all these massacres as "America generates more psycopaths."

Thats why I made that mention for the more recent escalation. I can't really answer what this country is thinking the past couple days or weeks. Me being who I am, I can't understand what would make a normal person snap to the degree they do. The ones that are already suffering from something need to be documented like we were talking before to keep them away or minimize their potential to do harm.

[chronicsmoke]

Originally Posted by Capita2JZGTE

Luckily for the rest of your Country, you don't speak for them. Also, I guarantee you wouldn't feel so big and tough without the Country you hate lingering right below you. You act like you're different but you Canadians aren't any different from Americans. Especially in the eyes of islamic terrorists. Just keep that in mind.

It was once said by a Japanese Admiral "You cannot invade mainland America. There would be a gun behind every blade of grass."

Haha we Canadians are viewed much differently around the world, whether the americans here would like to admit it or not..

If you're in a forign country and they are being rude to you, they probably think youre american. Tell them you're canadian and they are your best friend.

**** WHO IN THE FUCK IS GOING TO INVADE CANADA?****

No one. not the 'islamic terrorists' not the polar bears. We are more concerned with the USA invading in for more natural resources (or weapons of mass destruction as you reffer to them as)..

[Edge]

I can vouch for Canada's reputation.

I've been fortunate enough to travel to both the US and Canada, and have been welcomed by very polite people every time. But back home in the UK where people haven't had that opportunity?

Very cold towards Americans. The opposite goes for Canadians. Viewed as a lot friendlier. Of course, there is good and bad everywhere.