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Old 09-05-2007, 05:43 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Cool The "Official" Politics thread.

Ok here it is. The "Politics" Thread. Here is your chance to make it work. If it does an actual forum could become real. So post up your political articles, rants, whatever, and discuss.

Ground rules: Don't be a jerk and don't make it personal.

Other rules: This is not a democracy. If it gets peronal, lot's of swearing we will edit or delete posts. It's entirely up to us, so you'd be smart (waiting for paolo's response) to stay on our good side. Any problems you have, please bring it up to a mod. We'll look at it, discuss, make changes, punish, whatever seems necessary.

Finally, we have given snowolf mod powers and he is primarily going to be in charge of this thread. So congrats or maybe it's condolences to him.

Have at it gang...

Last edited by killclimbz; 09-05-2007 at 08:13 PM.
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Old 09-05-2007, 06:10 PM   #2 (permalink)
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eww politics -_-
 
Old 09-05-2007, 06:25 PM   #3 (permalink)
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yeah well i'm sure having a politics section will give the mods a little more to do around here :P
 
Old 09-06-2007, 07:36 AM   #4 (permalink)
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meh

i can't be arsed anymore

what a post for number 300!!!!

rah!
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Old 09-07-2007, 03:48 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Seems that President Bush is being true to form. Man did I get a laugh reading this.
MSNBC

Quote:
SYDNEY - Even for someone as gaffe-prone as President Bush, he was in rare form on Friday, confusing APEC with OPEC and transforming Australian troops into Austrians.

Bush's tongue started slipping almost as soon as he started talking at a business forum on the eve of an Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation (APEC) summit in Sydney.

"Mr. Prime Minister, thank you for your introduction," he told Prime Minister John Howard. "Thank you for being such a fine host for the OPEC summit."

As the audience of several hundred people erupted in laughter, Bush corrected himself and joked, "He invited me to the OPEC summit next year." Australia has never been a member of the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries.

Later in his speech, Bush recounted how Howard had gone to visit "Austrian troops" last year in Iraq. There are, in fact, no Austrian troops there. But Australia has about 1,500 Australians military personnel in and around the country.

Upon finishing his speech, Bush took the wrong way off-stage and, looking slightly perplexed, had to be re-directed by Howard to a center-stage exit.

But not before a veteran White House correspondent seized the opportunity to ask Bush whether there had been any new message in his speech. Apparently misunderstanding the question, he bristled and asked, "Haven't you been listening to my past speeches?" before turning away.

Bush is no stranger to the occasional faux pas, and often jokes about his habit of mangling the English language.


One of his highest-profile gaffes came in May when, at a welcoming ceremony for Britain's Queen Elizabeth II, he nearly placed her in the 18th century.

Then there was the famous incident at the G8 summit in St. Petersburg in 2006 when Bush, unaware he was on camera, greeted British Prime Minister Tony Blair with the words "Yo Blair."

Bush's sometimes muddled syntax and mispronunciation of words like nuclear ("nukular") have long been fodder for late-night TV comedians. But aides say his folksy style has helped endear him to Middle America.
That is about as far as my contribution goes in here...
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Old 09-07-2007, 05:10 PM   #6 (permalink)
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There is a small nation in this world, which for one reason or another, has always been a 'pet project' of US presidents.

this project, a claim of global benevolence and caring, is best summed up with the deceptively optimistic sound bite, 'the road map to peace'.

however:
Quote:
In its strongest condemnation of Israel since last summer's war, Human Rights Watch said yesterday that most Lebanese civilian casualties were caused by "indiscriminate Israeli air strikes".

HRW said there was no basis to the Israeli claim that civilian casualties resulted from Hizbollah guerrillas using civilians for cover. More than 1,000 Lebanese were killed in the 34-day conflict, which began after Hizbollah staged a cross-border raid, killing three Israeli soldiers and capturing two others.

Israeli aircraft targeted Lebanese infrastructure, including bridges and Beirut airport, and heavily damaged a district of Beirut as well as attacking Hizbollah centres in villages near the border. Hizbollah fired nearly 4,000 rockets at northern Israel, killing 119 soldiers. In the fighting, 40 Israeli civilians were killed.

"To the contrary, once the war started, most Hizbollah military officials and even many political officials left the villages," HRW said. "Most Hizbollah military activity was conducted from prepared positions outside Lebanese villages in the hills and valleys around."

The Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesman, Mark Regev, rejected the findings. "Hizbollah adopted a deliberate strategy of shielding itself behind the civilian population and turning the civilians in Lebanon into a human shield," he said.
Hizbollah 'did not use civilians as cover' - Independent Online Edition > Middle East

Israel/Lebanon: Israeli Indiscriminate Attacks Killed Most Civilians (Human Rights Watch, 6-9-2007)

The reason for why this story appealed to me more than other current issues (such as Dubya tasting his foot once again, or a US General threatening to tell us something we knew all the long) is that this little situation is the epicentre of what we see elsewhere in the region and thus the world. It is the stick that stirs this world up, which also enables the US to do what it wants, where ever it wants! But this stick itself is US in design! (sounds like a global government no?)

Last year, the israelis (IDF) kidnapped a load of Palestinians. In response and probably to use them as pawns for an exchange, Palestinians (aka the Hez) arrested some Israeli troops. Israel proceded to bomb seven shades of shite out of eveything. Anything. The world complained, the US who gives (NOT SELLS) most if not all of the IDF's weapons said nothing. Which is sad, because as the IDF is dependent on the US, the US is pretty much the only one the IDF is likely to listen to.

Many many innocent palestinians died because of the bombardment. It was seen to be completely disproprotionate. The US said it was a shame but unavoidable coz of those pesky Hez 'terrorists' hiding amoungst wimmin and children. Having seen the chaos in Irak with the 600 000 dead civilians there, it was clear that the IDF weren't likely to be much more accurate than the USMC etc when using the same (if not inferior) kit.

But finally we have in this report independent, verified and conclusive proof of what the 'bed wetting liberal peaceniks' have been saying all the long.

Meanwhile, the US still proceeds to send huge amounts of weapons to the IDF, whilst ignoring the Hez in even simple dialogue, purely beause the US has decided to categorise them as being 'terrorists'.

The IDF killed hundreds illegally and are 'good guys'
The Hez killed a few but are dismissed as terrorists.

If these situations were reversed, I AM TELLING YOU, that would be a genuine road map to peace.

A bit odd no?
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Old 09-07-2007, 06:55 PM   #7 (permalink)
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who said recently:

"You made one of your greatest mistakes, in that you neither brought to account nor punished those who waged this war...You permitted Bush to complete his first term, and stranger still, chose him for a second term, which gave him a clear mandate from you... to continue to murder our people in Iraq and Afghanistan".

are these the words of a crazy person; an extreme person; or someone merely speaking the truth?
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Old 09-08-2007, 07:01 AM   #8 (permalink)
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To lightly address yer first post wolfy....

the Israelis of course have a right to exist. few suggest otherwise, despite what might be claimed in various media. it is entirely the fault of postWW2 nations for the jewish state being built on arabic land. however, the expansion of this state thru illegal and violent means is not acceptable and has been the flash point that creates the cause of people like Hamas, Hezbollah, Fatah, OBL, AQ, Ahmadinejad...... the list goes on.

a minority of people have been gifted with the means to enforce their own endeavours at the cost of the locals. in turn, the locals are galvinised thru a sense of resistence. it is the exact same kinda thing that provokes the insurgency in Irak.

in nature, there is the 'asymmetry of the hunt'. best described: how can a spindly limbed and timid little gazelle ever stand a chance against a massive predator like a lion? during the chase the lion is working to realise just one meal. that is it. the deer meanwhile, is fighting for its very existance. for everything.

you have the mighty lion of the US military or the hugely funded IDF. you have the tiny deer of the under equipped Hamas or simple citizens of irak. lions will presume survival upon the basis of their superior strength. the gazelle acquire survival thru herding into groups. as one strikes against the other, any sense of making ground is superficial, as any offensive act merely functions to increase the fortitude of the other side.

the US lion takes the piss in the deer's grazing land of palestine; head deers like OBL send out the call and a herd forms called AQ. the resistence continues.

point is, when you draw in theological belief as a motive for this behaviour; ie when OBL would wish to promote the virtues of his religious belief, he can gain great respect by foreseeing the aggression of infidel america. his foresight is assurred, as he knows exactly what to do to gain the desired reaction. just in the same way Bush proclaims 'insurgents' to be 'evul terrorists' before the news cuts to more dead marines thanx to IEDs.

the perpetuation of conflict thru self-fulfilling prophecy.
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Old 09-08-2007, 07:08 AM   #9 (permalink)
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you second post is concerning mr wolf.

it is one thing to say that your gov has been incompetent or outright manevolent in its actions since being elected. but to say it was outright robbery or fraud... and yet your right to bare arms against a gov gone nuts, is to suggest an almost insane level of complacency.

if your perspective is accurate even in the slightest, then the acts of 9-11, acts allegedly motivated to hurt innocent people in order to mobilise them into action having been made aware of the terrorist's level of suffering being visited upon them, is justified!

are you really saying that the US population is so apathetic to what is done across the world in their name, that they genuinely deserved the WTC going pop?
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Old 09-08-2007, 08:05 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Today's story for me:

Quote:
A US federal judge has ordered Iran to pay $2.65bn (1.3bn) to the families of 241 marines killed in a 1983 bombing of their Beirut barracks.
But getting the money will be difficult and the families are backing a law in Congress that would make it easier for victims to claim such compensation.
Iran denies involvement in the bombing and did not respond to the lawsuit.

"This is a sense of victory, of winning a battle," said Paul Rivers, who was a 20-year-old marine on the second floor of the barracks when it exploded.
"When we win is when we collect, when we make them pay for what they did," he said.

US District Judge Royce C Lamberth called the ruling the largest such judgement by a US court against another country. It is the result of a six-year lawsuit brought by family members of the dead marines as well as those wounded in the 23 October 1983 attack, which was blamed on the militant Islamic group Hezbollah.
The Iranian government was accused of providing material and technical support to Hezbollah.
BBC NEWS | World | Middle East | Iran faces $2.65bn US bomb award

of course this is a nonsense. all this was, was an opportunity for a bunch of lawyers to ensure a consistent income for several years.

if this was ever cemented in international law and Iran was 'forced' to pay up for allegedly helping a foreign entity to do something they have been accused of (not proven guilty of), it would create such a huge precident, that the US would go financially belly up over night, from the inward flood of litigation claims.

Iran is alleged to have supported Hezbollah in the above attack?

Well we KNOW the US supported the IDF in the attacks on Palestine last year killing many more innocent civilians NOT military personnel.

but sod worrying about mere support... what of actual personal involvement in genocide of an entire nation? If 241 dead marines is worth $2.65 billion, what 'value' can be ascribed to 600 000+ dead irakis? how much did 'shock and awe' actually cost?

i will never get used to the bullshit manner in which the US tries to claim mistreatment and victimisation. it is so perversely nonsensical that it is funny, actually laff out loud funny.
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