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Old 12-26-2012, 09:40 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jjz View Post
i went to a chiro/doctor what ever they called.
He said i had a minor tear, most likely in the supraspinatus (part of rotator cuff).
This was 2 weeks ago and 3 days, the last time i felt bad pain was yesterday petting my dog i just felt it really sharp. Its weird how you can carry stuff, no pain, do a lot of stuff but one wrong movement and holy shit.

However its looking good as today i havent felt pain once, so if we get the full 10 cm im goin tmrw.

BTW: Sorry to the mods, i totally forgot about the slam section.
Supraspinatus is a muscle. It's deep to the deltoid and has the action of raising your arm away from your body - which is why you felt a sharp pain when petting your dog. Don't attempt any jumping jacks.

A minor tear in (non-weight bearing) muscle is FAR better than a tear in other soft tissues like ligaments or tendons. Unless the chiro/doc was referring to the tendon of the supraspinatus?

Either way, rest it by avoiding its action. If it's a muscle tear, it'll heal faster. If tendon, take it easy and don't push it.

Topicals like BioFreeze and Arnica will help it along. Ice and heat, also, especially since it's been over 2 wks.

Edit: What I mean by take it easy and don't push it if it's the tendon - not saying you can't get out tomorrow. Just be cautious about it and careful not to push its action (like in a fall).

Oh. And I'm not a doctor but I do know a bit about this stuff.

Last edited by EatRideSleep; 12-26-2012 at 09:44 PM.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:40 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by killclimbz View Post
If you tore your rotator cuff, it is going to stay that way until you have surgery. I've got a slight tear in my left rotator cuff. It is not going to get better unless I choose to go under the knife. So basically it's up to you if you can deal with the pain or not. Of course you could make it worse too, but that will probably just motivate you to go see the doc sooner.
Well it does depend on if you have a type I, II, or III tear. A type I (minor tear) can heal on it's own by reducing swelling and limited use. Type II or above will not heal on their own and will require surgery to repair, though there are always different cases.

Edit: Ice the shit out of it, take aleve (naproxin is the OTC name), then ice it more and take more naproxin. When it feels better, continue to ice the shit out of and take naproxin, after that repeat again. Ice for 15 min at a clip and 20-30 min off and repeat several times each night. If you still feel some pain after a couple weeks, you probably need surgery. Best bet, see a doctor to check it out. Do all of the above though either way.

Last edited by Efilnikufesin; 12-26-2012 at 09:46 PM.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:45 PM   #13 (permalink)
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He asked me the popping and clicking question, i wouldnt call it a click but there was a scrunching noise when i moved it.

I went at the end of the day (i continued snowboarding after fall) but went at around 5 oclock to the doctor.
He couldnt of asked about sleeping on it.

He did the external/ internal rotation strength test. Arm raising to front and above head. Pain was only felt raising arms above head.

Your right that the science is not yet definitive, and their are still some things that doctors just dont know what to do about.

I know a bodybuilder (IM a dedicated lifter), whose right shoulder gives out just outta the blue, Its not a joint but a nerve problem. Literally his brain just stops sending messages to his shoulder, and the doctors dont have any solution.
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Old 12-26-2012, 09:55 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by EatRideSleep View Post
Supraspinatus is a muscle. It's deep to the deltoid and has the action of raising your arm away from your body - which is why you felt a sharp pain when petting your dog. Don't attempt any jumping jacks.

A minor tear in (non-weight bearing) muscle is FAR better than a tear in other soft tissues like ligaments or tendons. Unless the chiro/doc was referring to the tendon of the supraspinatus?

Either way, rest it by avoiding its action. If it's a muscle tear, it'll heal faster. If tendon, take it easy and don't push it.

Topicals like BioFreeze and Arnica will help it along. Ice and heat, also, especially since it's been over 2 wks.

Edit: What I mean by take it easy and don't push it if it's the tendon - not saying you can't get out tomorrow. Just be cautious about it and careful not to push its action (like in a fall).

Oh. And I'm not a doctor but I do know a bit about this stuff.
Biofreeze and things like that are crap(sorry Eatridesleep, not trying to undermine!) Never put heat on it till the swelling is down. Heat will increase blood flow, but also increase swelling. Only heat to promote healing when swelling and pain has subsided.

Last edited by Efilnikufesin; 12-26-2012 at 10:07 PM.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:06 PM   #15 (permalink)
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This 10cm at Blue or Moonstone most likely right? So 10 in the middle of Christmas break and after they run the groomers over it. I don't think the risk of hurting it more is worth the 1cm of compacted "machine groomed packed powder" you'll be riding. On the hand it is a chance to ride a snowboard so nut up and do it. Just keep it mellow and you should be fine.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:08 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Ok first of all cuff tear is a very very very very general term as there are 4 cuff muscles.
The supraspinatus is not deep to the deltoid... I guess saying the tendon is deep might be better but its' not realyl something anyone ever says cause of where it goes.

Second, topicals only reduce pain, they do not change physiology by any means, and when they do it's very superficial. Also, the body needs inflammation for the area to heal. Anti-inflammatories longer term will impede this process from happening, they should only used for pain and acute situations.

Was there any pain in any of the muscle tests and did he do a bunch of them?
When you lift your arm your arm out to the side all the way up does it hurt?
Does it hurt lifting it forward? and where
Try this one, lift your arm up point your thumb down and then move it across your body, does that hurt and where?

My main point is that, pain in the shoulder can be caused by the neck, impingement, labrum, cuff, muscle strains ligament strains, scapula... ETC.....
Most docs are very terrible at differentiating one from the other, because they've never learned or haven't kept up to date on it. Saying cuff tear is a real half ass answer.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:08 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Biofreeze and things like that are crap(sorry mixie, not trying to undermine!) Never put heat on it till the swelling is down. Heat will increase blood flow, but also increase swelling. Only heat to promote healing when swelling and pain has subsided.
BioFreeze and Arnica actually treat the tissue and promote healing. NSAIDs do have anti-inflammatory action, but the risk there is that some can block the pain receptors. That's when additional injury can happen.

Correct; you don't want to apply heat with active inflammation. But the OP said it's been over 2 weeks so heat would be okay at this point. He didn't mention anything about swelling.

Ice stimulates circulation while not increasing inflammation. Which is why ice is preferred as the initial application to an injury.

Edit: Oh haha saw your edit re: mixie

Last edited by EatRideSleep; 12-26-2012 at 10:10 PM.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:21 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Ok first of all cuff tear is a very very very very general term as there are 4 cuff muscles.
The supraspinatus is not deep to the deltoid... I guess saying the tendon is deep might be better but its' not realyl something anyone ever says cause of where it goes.

Second, topicals only reduce pain, they do not change physiology by any means, and when they do it's very superficial. Also, the body needs inflammation for the area to heal. Anti-inflammatories longer term will impede this process from happening, they should only used for pain and acute situations.

Was there any pain in any of the muscle tests and did he do a bunch of them?
When you lift your arm your arm out to the side all the way up does it hurt?
Does it hurt lifting it forward? and where
Try this one, lift your arm up point your thumb down and then move it across your body, does that hurt and where?

My main point is that, pain in the shoulder can be caused by the neck, impingement, labrum, cuff, muscle strains ligament strains, scapula... ETC.....
Most docs are very terrible at differentiating one from the other, because they've never learned or haven't kept up to date on it. Saying cuff tear is a real half ass answer.
Sorry, deep to the deltoid in action, meaning supportive. It's palpable so not deep in terms of depth.

I have to disagree about topicals not having physiological benefit. What about transdermals? The skin absorbs.

I agree with you about shoulder pain being secondary to other things like the cervical issues, impingements, issues of the scapula, etc.

And you are SO right about most MDs not being good at musculoskeletal injuries and the reasons for that.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:25 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by EatRideSleep View Post
BioFreeze and Arnica actually treat the tissue and promote healing. NSAIDs do have anti-inflammatory action, but the risk there is that some can block the pain receptors. That's when additional injury can happen.

Correct; you don't want to apply heat with active inflammation. But the OP said it's been over 2 weeks so heat would be okay at this point. He didn't mention anything about swelling.

Ice stimulates circulation while not increasing inflammation. Which is why ice is preferred as the initial application to an injury.

Edit: Oh haha saw your edit re: mixie
Lol, was looking at two threads, mixie was in the other. But to add there is always swelling in that type of injury after two weeks, especially if it hasn't been attended to. Used to be a minor league pitcher and powerlifter as well and have seen and had more shoulder injuries than probably this whole site combined, well maybe.

Topical packs and rubs only provide temporary relief without actually doing anything to help the injury, real ice (with no buffer, just throw a bag of ice on) and anti inflammatories work much better.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:43 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Lol, was looking at two threads, mixie was in the other. But to add there is always swelling in that type of injury after two weeks, especially if it hasn't been attended to. Used to be a minor league pitcher and powerlifter as well and have seen and had more shoulder injuries than probably this whole site combined, well maybe.

Topical packs and rubs only provide temporary relief without actually doing anything to help the injury, real ice (with no buffer, just throw a bag of ice on) and anti inflammatories work much better.
Haha I thought maybe it was because all chick riders appear alike on the internet.

Good point about the presence of inflammation if not attended to in two weeks time. It also depends upon the degree. This is a minor tear according to the info. I was under the impression the OP did something, like rest it, considering he went to the doctor day-of. So, heat should be okay at this point. You don't want inflammation stagnating; heat and ice can help get it flushed. Heat at the initial stages can do damage so ice then is best.

With your background of pitching and powerlifting, I'm sure you've seen a lot of issues in the shoulders!

Yeah, I agree that most well known topicals like icy hot (which is crap imo) don't do anything. But the topicals I've tried and mentioned do work for me and others. But they're only one facet of the approach.

I love ice. Straight ice, like you said no buffer. I personally stay away from traditional NSAIDs and pain blockers, however. Pain is the body's version of a warning signal not to overuse/over injure.
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