Do you guys give your Lift Ticket away? - Page 3 - Snowboarding Forum - Snowboard Enthusiast Forums
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:33 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MistahTaki View Post
obviously they won't make profit if you get ur ticket from some person in the parking lot. I don't see why they will be hurt by one person getting on the lifts for free. they are constantly operating.
It's never just one person though, and never only once.
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Old 12-12-2010, 09:44 PM   #22 (permalink)
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I think it's wrong to cheat someone out of income, even if you can get away with it. You can justify it all kinds of ways, and say it doesn't happen enough to financially affect the resort, or that the pass is already paid for, but in the end you're still causing a loss of income for the business by allowing some else to not pay their contribution. At month's end it affects the profit & loss statement. Hypothetically if three people in one day sold their pass in the parking lot, at about $70 per full price pass the resort did not make $210 that they would have. That lost income could have employed a lift operator, patrol, maintenance guy, ski school instructor, or kitchen worker for the day. There are worse offenses in the world but it's still cheating the business (theft of services?).

I hope that those people who buy/sell their tickets never complain about shabby facilities, poor maintenance, lack of services, etc.
That's a silly way to look at it. There is a potential loss of income ONLY if you assume that person would have paid for a lift ticket. Thus they only lose out on potential income. For example, If I failed to acquire a lift ticket I would just go home. Thus the mountain is not losing out on my income, because it would've never existed in the first place.

I obviously understand that if everyone did this resorts would go bankrupt. However, this is not the same as stealing (where a person actually causes a loss of income).

Or a another way to look at it is: The resort is making billions of dollars a year, to them $70 is nothing. To me $70 is a LOT.
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Old 12-12-2010, 10:01 PM   #23 (permalink)
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That's a silly way to look at it. There is a potential loss of income ONLY if you assume that person would have paid for a lift ticket. Thus they only lose out on potential income. For example, If I failed to acquire a lift ticket I would just go home. Thus the mountain is not losing out on my income, because it would've never existed in the first place.

I obviously understand that if everyone did this resorts would go bankrupt. However, this is not the same as stealing (where a person actually causes a loss of income).

Or a another way to look at it is: The resort is making billions of dollars a year, to them $70 is nothing. To me $70 is a LOT.
Your numbers are off. I wouldn't be surprised if for the majority they are just scrapping by year by year.

(Don't always think of it as like at Vail... think about it as if it was your own local mountain that needs every ticket they can get).
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Old 12-12-2010, 10:10 PM   #24 (permalink)
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That's a silly way to look at it. There is a potential loss of income ONLY if you assume that person would have paid for a lift ticket. Thus they only lose out on potential income. For example, If I failed to acquire a lift ticket I would just go home. Thus the mountain is not losing out on my income, because it would've never existed in the first place.

I obviously understand that if everyone did this resorts would go bankrupt. However, this is not the same as stealing (where a person actually causes a loss of income).

Or a another way to look at it is: The resort is making billions of dollars a year, to them $70 is nothing. To me $70 is a LOT.
Who on earth goes all the way to a resort without the intent to buy a pass if necessary??? If I'm going to the trouble of getting my gear together and driving to a resort, then I come with whatever money I might need. Your method would be analogous to going to a restaurant then hoping someone gives you their doggy bag in the parking lot. It works for homeless guys once in awhile but most responsible adults come ready to pay.

A resort makes billions per year? Is that profit or is that gross, before expenses? I don't know about that. I think some are barely making ends meet. Do any industry insiders here know the actual profit margins?

And it's never just one $70 pass one time. Every little thing adds up. One illicit pass here, a stolen candy bar there, a broken chair that needs to be replaced here. Repeat every day of the relatively short season. It has to be hard for a business to be profitable when it's only open for less than half the year.

Edit: what I found on the internet on initial search
http://whistlerblackcombsnowreport.c...esort-1949.htm

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUST...8?pageNumber=1

http://investors.vailresorts.com/rel...leaseID=510443

http://www.bendbulletin.com/apps/pbc.../1097/PODCASTS

Last edited by Toecutter; 12-12-2010 at 10:39 PM.
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Old 12-12-2010, 10:54 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Agreed

..........
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Originally Posted by Toecutter View Post
Who on earth goes all the way to a resort without the intent to buy a pass if necessary??? If I'm going to the trouble of getting my gear together and driving to a resort, then I come with whatever money I might need. Your method would be analogous to going to a restaurant then hoping someone gives you their doggy bag in the parking lot. It works for homeless guys once in awhile but most responsible adults come ready to pay.

A resort makes billions per year? Is that profit or is that gross, before expenses? I don't know about that. I think some are barely making ends meet. Do any industry insiders here know the actual profit margins?

And it's never just one $70 pass one time. Every little thing adds up. One illicit pass here, a stolen candy bar there, a broken chair that needs to be replaced here. Repeat every day of the relatively short season. It has to be hard for a business to be profitable when it's only open for less than half the year.

Edit: what I found on the internet on initial search
FOR SALE - Whistler Blackcomb Ski Resort | Whistler Blackcomb Snow Report

Ski resorts weather tough economy | Reuters

Vail Resorts Management Company | Vail Resorts Reports Fiscal 2010 Results and 2011 Outlook

Region's ski resorts see ups and downs; Hoodoo saw more visitors, but flat profits, this season, and Bachelor has seen a decline in skiers altogether. How could that affect ticket prices when next winter rolls around? | podcast local | The Bulletin
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Old 12-12-2010, 11:10 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Who on earth goes all the way to a resort without the intent to buy a pass if necessary???
Uphill skinners exempted (but they don't use the lift, obviously and this conversation doesn't really apply to them). They do benefit from grooming and patrol without paying for it though.
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Old 12-12-2010, 11:18 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Question from somebody in the midwest. Here our passes are stickers that go on metal hangers. Once they are on you can't get them off with out ruining them. Same thing for the other place I've been and they check to make sure they aren't easy to remove. What are the major resorts using that makes it easy to sell them?
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Old 12-12-2010, 11:52 PM   #28 (permalink)
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I see no difference between getting someone's ticket for free and downloading movies on the internet. The resort is losing out on potential ticket sales and the studio is losing out on the potential movie sale/rental.
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Old 12-13-2010, 01:20 AM   #29 (permalink)
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for the most part ski resorts are owned by mega rich people. I don't feel bad for them. like most American corporations, the money is all funneled to the top. with the ceo's and owners raking in millions upon millions while the average joes working there like lifties and ski patrol are working for minimum wage. fuck those mothr fuckers. steal every penny from them that you can.
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Old 12-13-2010, 01:41 AM   #30 (permalink)
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for the most part ski resorts are owned by mega rich people. I don't feel bad for them. like most American corporations, the money is all funneled to the top. with the ceo's and owners raking in millions upon millions while the average joes working there like lifties and ski patrol are working for minimum wage. fuck those mothr fuckers. steal every penny from them that you can.
true. making $45+ from hundreds people that buy a ticket sums up pretty huge, also overpriced food. 3 bucks for a little bottle of water? f that.
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