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Return to softboots?

5K views 33 replies 10 participants last post by  Nivek 
#1 · (Edited)
I am moving to Colorado next month, and figure it might be time to switch back to softboots (I hardboot, but my current gear is just good for groomed runs, to get a hardboot setup to work all mountain would be kind of troublesome).

Is there, anything out there that can support someone 225lbs, with a 25.6cm foot (~ 7.5-8 US), but with a 11cm width? (my 10.5 US shoe 4E doesn't contain my foot width)... with a board with an appropriate waist (in other words, a narrow waisted board, so my foot doesn't end up inbounds), but still has the length for my riding style? (160+) and supports my weight?

my 160 neversummer heritage 2009 with a 25.4cm waist and a 7.85m sidecut, is too wide for me. (the last model before they went rocker)

or am I effed and limited to hardboots? :p :p
I know the season in Colorado starts wayyy earler than in NY, and I'm pretty stoked!

The board needs to be stiff enough to handle high speed, laid over until my butt is sliding on heel sides, or complete eurocarves both wings, while being versatile enough for powder, trees, etc...
My naked feet must be right over the edges with no inbound for maximum leverage, and I prefer forward stance angles, I would say 30/15 or 21/6 or so, 21/12... whatever.

I have palmer riser plates too currently.
 
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#2 ·
i can't understand why for any reason you would be limited to hard boots in any circumstance, ever, except maybe GS racing.

if you (for whatever reason) think that your "naked feet must be right over the edges with no inbound" then you better get to shops and start standing ontop of boards with no shoes on....
 
#3 ·
I said I might be limited to hardboots cause you can have them stretched among all sorts of things for a weirdly shaped foot. (length of a size 7.5-8 foot yet wider than 4e in a 10.5 shoe..... and extremely flat feet).

Having inbound feet results in a huge loss of leverage, and yes I will be standing on boards in shops with a naked foot.... err... socks on... if I decide to go back to softboots for my all mountain needs.

Not too knowledgeable about boards, most if not all softboot boards that seem to be the right width for me are always ~152cm, and suggested for riders below.. 180? lbs...
 
#4 ·
32's fit me well I have flat wide feet. You could get them punched around by a bootfitter to accommodate certain areas.

I don't really see how a normal width board is "too wide" for you. Wide boards are too wide because they are usually a fatter version of the original - and people only ride them because their feet are too big. Since you are obviously big enough to ride a 160, you must have the strength to turn it... Foot size is only relevant dealing with toe overhang, if you weigh 225 your Heritage is not too wide for you, get used to riding a proper board instead of a monoski. I'm trying to wrap my head around your issue, its difficult for my pea size drug addled mind.

Get stronger? Lose 80lbs? Hey I'm working on shrinking my own beergut right now, it aint easy just sayin, aint judgin...
 
#5 ·
32's fit me well I have flat wide feet. You could get them punched around by a bootfitter to accommodate certain areas.

I don't really see how a normal width board is "too wide" for you. Wide boards are too wide because they are usually a fatter version of the original - and people only ride them because their feet are too big. Since you are obviously big enough to ride a 160, you must have the strength to turn it... Foot size is only relevant dealing with toe overhang, if you weigh 225 your Heritage is not too wide for you, get used to riding a proper board instead of a monoski. I'm trying to wrap my head around your issue, its difficult for my pea size drug addled mind.

Get stronger? Lose 80lbs? Hey I'm working on shrinking my own beergut right now, it aint easy just sayin, aint judgin...
Erm no, the foot size-board width relationship is not just relevant for dealing with overhangs. Rather, a board that is too wide for a certain foot/shoe size will make it quote hard to get adequate edge pressure/control - otherwise we could all just ride wider boards
In fact, ideally there should be some toe/heel overhang of the boot - see wiredsport's excellent discussion of appropriate board width.
 
#7 · (Edited)
Sorry I am aware of what you are saying, both guys, just have a hard time understanding your dilemma. Obviously you dont want to go try to ride a wide board with small feet, I just can't imagine a normal width board being TOO WIDE for someone who has that much body mass. If you are determined to ride a 160 - I have no problems on a 154 at 180lbs and you could ride ANY normal width 154 with size 7.5 or 8s.

I'm not trying to be an asshole I'm just saying somethings gotta give or go find someone to make you a special board.
 
#9 ·
Sorry I am aware of what you are saying, both guys, just have a hard time understanding your dilemma. Obviously you dont want to go try to ride a wide board with small feet, I just can't imagine a normal width board being TOO WIDE for someone who has that much body mass. If you are determined to ride a 160 - I have no problems on a 154 at 180lbs and you could ride ANY normal width 154 with size 7.5 or 8s.

I'm not trying to be an asshole I'm just saying somethings gotta give or go find someone to make you a special board.
Fair enough, I just disagreed with your logic/reasoning that a board cannot be too wide - however, I pretty much agree with your conclusion that the OP should be able to ride a regular width board even with his weight and shoe size.

In fact, the GNU Billy Goat might suit the OP - stiff, fast, very good edge hold, mellow sidecut, good float in powder and quite narrow (only 25/25.3/25.5 for 159/162/165).

But only the OP knows why he is using riser plates and those extreme stance angles...
 
#16 ·
Hi Noir,

Wow. You have 3 major things working against you:

1. A very large discepancy between your weight and foot size.

Boards designed for 2225 lb riders are typically not designed for size 7.5.

2. An unusually wide foot which has you wearing a boot which is 3 full sizes larger than your foot.

Not great for heel lift. Not great for toe drag (assuming we find you a board that suits your weight at the correct width)

3. You prefer very forward angles.

This effectively requires and even narrower board for you to get the toe/heel position and leverage that you are after.

-------------------------------------------------

That is the bad news (and you knew that). What to do.

Boots: I would suggest going to all of your local shops and trying on a zillion boots. 3 sizes above your shoe size is too much (even to accomodate a 4E). You need to bring that down and I believe you can doo this without going to custom boots. Heat molded liners can help a lot here and can allow extra width in the molding process without extra length. Also, you need to be using the thinnest snowboard socks available.

Board: Narrow as possible. There are some smaller manufacturers that have very narrow options available. I have not seen or ridden those so you will want to get other opinions on models/how well they perform. If you go with mainstream models that are built for your weight it will be a matter of compromise. Less than ideal width, non-preferred angles.
 
#17 ·
Thank you for all the help.

I think what I'll do is visit a very reputable bootfitter in the Denver area, get a full custom footbed made (money is no object, I am sick of foot pain), and have his recommendation to various boot choices, soft or hard and go from there.
 
#20 ·
I was thinking Larry's Bootfitting in Boulder. Although, surprise surprise, I will be in the living in the CO Springs area, where is your shop located? I may stop by late October when I move in.

I am most likely going to get a loveland season pass with some visits to Monarch (ever been there?)

To be completely honest, at this point in time I'm considering a modified hardboot setup as it provides the stiffness i crave with longetivity in materials (materials wont' break down as fast compared to softboots resulting in a less stiff boot)... but I am completely open.

How are burton driver's for wide feet?

Off the top of my head, my ideal softboot setup would be burton drivers, or some customizable stiff, stiff softboot, with a binding offering just the right progressive flex in the highback (clueless!), with a regular camber board with a 10+ m sidecut radius and long running length... (Probably a bx board or some variant).. but short enough for maneuverability...I'm guessing between 160-170 with stiffness in materials for a rider my weight.

I wish I wasn't so OCD. But I know what I want and realize the performance downgrade in poor fitting equipment. Not to meantion.... I think underleveraging amplifies arch pain from toeside carves... I think... If I was to ride my current softboot setup (wrong sized), i would bias both bindings towards the toes... less leverage, no high back... to compensate.
 
#24 ·
By then I'll be in Breck. But I work at the CSG in the Springs. We have some other very good boot fitters and guys that are certified with full custom cork Superfeet. And as far as your board requirements, I know of nothing short of an alpine board or full custom that is going to have a 10+ sidecut.

You want a softboot alpine setup. That doesn't exist anymore. Even boardercross is dying. You are going to have to compromise somewhere, either suck it up and ride what is now standard, or spend upwards of $2k.

Custom insoles will absolutely help with arch stresses.

If you're going to live in CO and ride more than once a month I'd just get the EPIC pass. Unlimited to Vail, Beave, Breck, Keyston, A-Basin, Northstar, Kirkwood, and Heavenly. You will love the Beave for your type of riding. Monarch always has good snow, but I wish they had like 1000 more vertical feet.
 
#22 ·
Another thing that will help foot pain for you is being here and riding more.

When I ride once a week or less my feet always hurt the first run or so just cuz of how I clench em up and shit. Whenever I get 2 or more days a week I have no issues. Those are alot of small muscles which if not used regularly can give you alot of grief.
 
#26 ·
I decided I want softboots (well, my hardboots are a bit tight for all mountain use, don't want to buy new hardboots, they are EXPENSIVE)... I rather spend everything on a nice, new (or maybe used) high performance softboot setup!

Most likely bx based, as I really want STIFF. I don't believe softboots can be stiff enough? The softer flexing hardboots feel extremely "noodley" to me... so...

However I understand the disadvantages of a poorly interfaced system (the board will of course be stiff), this is concerning binding/boot interface.

how is burton driver x paired with c02/c60 (which?)
I think most bx'er sare on driver x's with c02's?
How about salomon malamutes?

I'm not into any overly cushy bindings like NOW's, unless I'm mistaken, I understand people like them, but I believe softboots themselves already introduce enough slop into the system and that any extra is detrimental (guessing, hardboots have elastometer systems/flex in the bindings for slop, including iso plates.. so nothing new here).
 
#27 ·
I decided I want softboots (well, my hardboots are a bit tight for all mountain use, don't want to buy new hardboots, they are EXPENSIVE)... I rather spend everything on a nice, new (or maybe used) high performance softboot setup!

Most likely bx based, as I really want STIFF. I don't believe softboots can be stiff enough? The softer flexing hardboots feel extremely "noodley" to me... so...

However I understand the disadvantages of a poorly interfaced system (the board will of course be stiff), this is concerning binding/boot interface.

how is burton driver x paired with c02/c60 (which?)
I think most bx'er sare on driver x's with c02's?
How about salomon malamutes?

.
I have C60's, super stiff and responsive. I wear ions with them.

It sounds like you are trying to make a softboot setup into a carving setup, are you sure this is what you should do? The soft boot stance is sideways, unlike carving where shoulders face down the hill. I used to ride a forward stance in soft boots and through some lessons was convinced that to improve my turns I needed to get at least to zero on my back foot.

Consider carving in your carving board and using a more conventional stance and technique on the softboot setup.
 
#28 ·
Overall technique is what matters in carving over body position on the board. Sure a more sideways facing stance is less than ideal, but it can be done. The concepts are the same but the body movements to achieve them are different, no biggie.

I'm looking ride with angles approximately 21/6, 30/15, 21/12 or in that area (actually the stance will be determined by the board width)

Are the c60's canted? I will most likely need canting on both bindings, bent inwards due to knock knees.
 
#30 ·
Actually yes I have, was just considering other options (as those bindings are 400+)... also those bindings have quite.. a lot of screws.... (not opposed, but not for them either, mainly due to the cost)... although if I really need em, I'll get em. lol
 
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