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Old 02-01-2014, 01:06 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I know Nev Lapwood and I think he's done a great job with SA. But he's got everybody thinking even legged pop is "proper" and now I've seen it in the CASI manual. And while it might be a safe teaching method it's a technique that was more common off of giant tables.

The best riders I see everyday are popping off their tail on 3s and less and almost always on straight airs. And some of the sickest riders I know pull that technique on pretty big booters.

Both ways work. But it's the raddest feeling and the sickest style to see a guy who gets a freaking rainbow arch off a simple kicker. I can't even stand to hit small or medium size jumps without it.

What's funny is you don't need to teach it, gifted riders seem to figure it out on their own. I saw a 14 year old kid throwing the most beautiful straight airs in the park the other day. I didn't think at 110 pounds he would have enough speed to clear the knuckle but he was absolutely boosting off his tail on every kicker. You can recognize a rider who has this on lock because the arc of their jumps have a noticeably different trajectory than everyone else. If you ride camber and pop your tail right on a kicker you can feel the "straight up" trajectory you get. It's a rush it feels for a second like catching an updraft in a plane. It makes straight airs and ones on smaller and medium sized jumps feel great.

Eventually guys using even pop will dial in their timing so that the back foot and tail start to catch the lip better. But back in the day we were taught in the park how to ollie or snap your tail off the jump. They would tell you to push the board away from you at the lip and pull it back under you once in the air. Some guys would call this motion an ollie or a sort-of-ollie. I know other guys who came up skating and would always refer to it as snapping the tail.

But a big difference today is that everybody is spinning a lot!

Last edited by tonicusa; 02-01-2014 at 01:23 AM.
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Old 02-01-2014, 01:23 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonicusa View Post
I know Nev Lapwood and I think he's done a great job with SA. But he's got everybody thinking even legged pop is "proper" and now I've seen it in the CASI manual. And while it might be a safe teaching method it's a technique that was more common off of giant tables.

The best riders I see everyday are popping off their tail on 3s and less and almost always on straight airs. And some of the sickest riders I know pull that technique on pretty big booters.

Both ways work. But it's the raddest feeling and the sickest style to see a guy who gets a freaking rainbow arch off a simple kicker. I can't even stand to hit small or medium size jumps without it.
Erm, I run a totally different snowboard company to SA and Nev, not sure why we're bringing him into this, although I guess me and Nev teach spinning the same way in the same resort town (we're both Canadian instructors so it wouldn't surprise me if we do).

As you said, both ways work, I think the method you're describing is rarely taught anymore because of the way instructing tends to work.

In general, instructors like to teach the most common way that will be easiest to learn and that can easily be applied to the most things. So while your method of ollies works fine on smaller jumps, instructors like teaching the current pop method that will be the most stable and apply to all jumps (small, medium and large jumps).

Your way would work too, but if instructors taught that, then they have to teach them this technique, then the other technique later for bigger jumps, then teach the difference in when you should use it etc. etc. Plus a lot of people tend to struggle with being stable and doing ollies off jumps when they're beginner/intermediate riders just getting into park.

You're right, a lot of good riders ollie off small hits to get more air. It's just slightly more advanced and instructors don't like to teach it early on because it tends to screw people up trying to learn it vs. just teaching pop first.

To give another example, it's kind of like how you can 180 off a jump by rotation and counter rotation (rotating your upper and lower body opposite ways - like how you rotate for a frontside boardslide to regular), and some advanced riders will use that counter rotated 180 to add cool shiftys and other things into their 180, but it's not taught as much to beginners early on because it tends to mess with them if they get used to counter rotating their 180s, then have to change their entire technique up to do 360s and 540s.

So yeah, hope that sheds some light on why you're seeing more people taught pop vs. learning ollies off jumps right away. It's just about instructors preferring teaching the easier to learn, and more useful technique before they get to advanced methods that are more of a special use technique.
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Last edited by Jed; 02-01-2014 at 01:28 AM.
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Old 02-01-2014, 01:28 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Yeah I ride with a lot of instructor buddies and they've been telling me the same thing for the past couple years. You do see the average rider much better prepared in the park now a days. So I understand why they do it.

The old "Jumping with Jussi" videos were the first big thing back in the day before all of the online teaching. And it was hilarious because he had a pretty strong accent and would finish every narration with "snap an ollie off your tail and spot your landing". He was the "Horgmo" back then. Without the triple cork

Last edited by tonicusa; 02-01-2014 at 01:36 AM.
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Old 02-01-2014, 02:19 AM   #14 (permalink)
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The old "Jumping with Jussi" videos were the first big thing back in the day before all of the online teaching. And it was hilarious because he had a pretty strong accent and would finish every narration with "snap an ollie off your tail and spot your landing". He was the "Horgmo" back then. Without the triple cork
Yeah it's funny how far instructing has come, I remember the old jumping with jussi videos. I remember at one point transworld even hired one of top N. American coaches to try make their trick tip DVDs better for beginners vs. their old method of just hiring pros to recite how they do a trick (although I have no idea how well that worked out).

It's kind of crazy that 5-10 years ago there was barely any freestyle instruction outside of in-person lessons, but now you have guys like me or nev or any number of other guys making videos on youtube offering trick tips online.
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Old 02-01-2014, 03:20 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Remember our last conversation Jed. Prime example of what you do.

"not sure why some people are telling you to add ollie or do other things"

Or is that too complicated for you buddy?

Yes I know, I'm not contributing but am I the only one that see his pattern. Probably. I'm a loner anyway.

Last edited by Mystery2many; 02-01-2014 at 03:30 AM.
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Old 02-01-2014, 03:34 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Remember our last conversation Jed. Prime example of what you do.

Yes I know, I'm not contributing but am I the only one that see his pattern. Probably. I'm a loner anyway.
? We had a very civilized and interesting back and forth about pop technique. He knew I wasn't attacking him or anything like that.

He went into it answering a different pop question as we later figured out and we both agreed that both techniques work and we talked about how it was just a difference in how instructing has changed over the years to try to help beginners better.

No one was offended and we both talked like adults. This is unlike how conversions with you tend to go because you act like a passive aggressive 10 year old and also like talking about things you don't know anything about, whereas tonicusa seems to not be talking bs.

Stop trying to stir up your nonsense.
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Old 02-01-2014, 09:16 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystery2many View Post
Remember our last conversation Jed. Prime example of what you do.

"not sure why some people are telling you to add ollie or do other things"

Or is that too complicated for you buddy?

Yes I know, I'm not contributing but am I the only one that see his pattern. Probably. I'm a loner anyway.
Please refer to the member guidelines member-guidelines.html
about "ongoing battles". Manny, as reluctant as I am to pick sides, Jed is showing a lot of self control. Most people (including me, I admit) would have gone postal by now.
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