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6K views 41 replies 14 participants last post by  twowheeled 
#1 ·
Hey guys,

So I'm considering taking off my spring semester of college to work out in the ski industry in the mountains for the season. I'm an Outdoor Recreation major and would like experience as an instructor because I would eventually like to work as a backcountry guide for a heliskiing company. I currently live in the Midwest and would be working as an instructor over winter break if I decide not to take a semester off. Do most resorts require experience? And what would be the best resorts to work for in the mountains?
 
#2 ·
Finish college first. If your degree is valuable to you, don't lose focus. You can become a ski bum after you finish, I'm sure you'll have plenty of years left to bum around. Those are great aspirations, but being a lifty and making minimum wage while putting off college is not going to help you achieve your long term goals.
 
#3 ·
yea...I would agree. I would not want to return to college after screwing around for a semester. Plus you will be dirt poor to boot. I'm living the dream being a ski bum after graduating and working a real job for a couple of years. But I'm a bum with a vehicle, money to buy whatever gear I want, go to whatever resort I choose, etc.
 
#4 ·
Hey guys,

would eventually like to work as a backcountry guide for a heliskiing company. I currently live in the Midwest....what would be the best resorts to work for in the mountains?
finish school, get some certs and experience in the summer...like emt, wilderness emergency certs, aiare, nols stuff

and btw...being a liftee or instructor is not going to do much...but get you on the mountian and perhaps meeting some folks to go with out into the bc

and get out of the midwest...and got to go to the mountian...

American Alpine Institute - Mountaineering School and Guide Service
 
#5 ·
First off your college degree means shit if you are going to be a guide unless you're taking outdoor first responder, wilderness survival, guiding, orienteering, and classes like that which actually make sense.

Second instructing is the worst decision you could make. You would be better to reach out to a heli ski or guide operation and see if you could shadow/intern/mentor with them. I've had friends do this it's actually relatively short but the experience you get is far more valuable than anything you would get from being an instructor.

Third if you aren't going to listen to this just know that ski resorts want you for the entirety of the season and taking off your "spring" semester isn't enough you need to be able to move in and be there before Thanksgiving. You'll make slave wages, live in staff housing with up to 3 other minimum wage snow carnies, and probably get a disease or starve from malnourishment.
 
#6 ·
You'll make slave wages, live in staff housing with up to 3 other minimum wage snow carnies, and probably get a disease or starve from malnourishment.

He's right. Instructors don't get paid for being there. They only get paid while they are teaching lessons. The international workers at my job only get minimum wage and I believe they need to purchase their own food. I'm glad I have my own means of housing up here, and a meal plan that is bundled in with my tuition. Other wise I would not be able to live the way I do. You will more than likely get sick. And you will for sure be hungry. Not a good idea do as others have posted. An instructor job is good for someone who has retired and has stabile income, or a person that is still living at home with mom and dad where the costs are relatively low.
 
#21 ·
As if paying 75 bucks for a lift ticket isn't enough for you? No, what they need to do is lower the price 10 dollars and watch the people roll in. The resort i work at charges 70 bucks a ticket and only cleared 3,500 people during massachusetts vacation, which is our busiest time of the year. Bottom line is the price of lift tickets is to expensive, and the industry is suffering because they are charging way to much, if they lowered the price by 10 bucks there would be way more people on the mountain, and they could pay people more. I guarantee if i had a hold of the books for some of these resorts, performed a break even analysis per ticket, and dropped the price a little bit according to the BEA tells me there would be a lot more people on the mountain. When the mountain does half price tickets, they bring in 5k plus... Seems to me that if they dropped the price 10 bucks i estimate they would do around 4000-4500 people a day.

I think some of you need to take a step back, and realize that just because you live in bro-town and you're burned out, it is not a fair reflection on the entire ski industry.

Your idea is entirely feasible, don't give up on it. What you do not want to do is work at a mountain that doesn't look after their staff. All those stories above, they all exist. However, just as there are shitty mountains to work at, there are also some really good ones.

I know that Jackson and Aspen Ski Co compensate their staff very well. You will also find instructors at these mountains that double as backcountry guides - not so much heli, more touring. Making connections with these people would be a very good idea, gain as much knowledge as you can.

The positives are that you are a girl, and you have an education. If you have some people skills and a level of professionalism then you can get a Job, but its probably going to be part-time. Almost any mountain is going to ask that you show up during busy times, xmas, presidents etc - if you cant do those days then you might have a tough time.

Best of luck to you.
A lot of mountains can't afford to pay their people... like the one i work at... its no secret they are in the red... but they do take care of us (the employees)... upper management is nothing but accommodating to us. they give us all a pass, we can get tix to almost any resort in NH if we ask for them, we get 10 free lift tickets for friends and family, and they throw parties for us pretty frequently... Its not that they dont want too... its that they simply cant... but as i stated above there are things that are being done wrong, and can probably be fixed.
 
#9 ·
There is also lots of competition for those jobs associated with heli outfits from what I have heard. And this is among people with a lot of mountain experience. I don't want to sound like a downer, but the goal to work for a heli outfit is pretty ambitious.

As an aside, some people have the right personality to be an instructor, but many don't. I would hate that job... but that's just me. Good luck and get a degree first.
 
#10 ·
I think some of you need to take a step back, and realize that just because you live in bro-town and you're burned out, it is not a fair reflection on the entire ski industry.

Your idea is entirely feasible, don't give up on it. What you do not want to do is work at a mountain that doesn't look after their staff. All those stories above, they all exist. However, just as there are shitty mountains to work at, there are also some really good ones.

I know that Jackson and Aspen Ski Co compensate their staff very well. You will also find instructors at these mountains that double as backcountry guides - not so much heli, more touring. Making connections with these people would be a very good idea, gain as much knowledge as you can.

The positives are that you are a girl, and you have an education. If you have some people skills and a level of professionalism then you can get a Job, but its probably going to be part-time. Almost any mountain is going to ask that you show up during busy times, xmas, presidents etc - if you cant do those days then you might have a tough time.

Best of luck to you.
 
#20 ·
You are a moron plain and simple.

Instructing is not guiding plain and simple.

I would never put my life in the hands of a snowboard instructor in a BC situation. I've witnessed too many of those fucktards get worked or make stupid rookie mistakes all under the guise of being a "PROFESSIONAL SNOWBOARD INSTRUCTOR".

You want to be a guide you need Wilderness First Responder 1 training, EMT level 1 would be a better option, Avy level 2 minimum but I would hope they are going for Avy 3. Then there's the time you need in an actual Heli being dropped. Add to that competent riding abilities, but last time I checked riding the Midwest isn't going to give you huge vertical challenges regardless of how many tow rope laps you make. Add to that an understanding of peoples abilities and whether they will freeze or step up in certain situations.

The BC guide thing is not something one enters into lightly. You are the nanny and steward of those entering into uncontrolled situations.

I may live in the dead center of the Bro-Muda triangle but I am far from jaded or burnt out. I'm a realist and one who has lost friends to poor decisions by themselves or others in the BC. I'm also one that knows that instructing will not help you nor will a college degree in this. Far better to not sugar coat it than to just blow smoke up someones ass and watch them spend money and time on worthless endeavors that won't help their end result.
 
#11 ·
working for a mountain has nothing to do with BC guiding. it won't help you, it will take away from time you should be learning BC shit. if you want to guide in the BC you need to be more competent and knowledgeable than the vast majority of your clients. you will learn none of that at a resort. especially instructing.
 
#12 ·
Yup I taught riding for years at multiple resorts. Until you get up to level 2 and 3 certs (which you can't do in one year) you'll spend 90% of your time doing jay turns and showing how to hold a heel edge. on the bunny slope. You'll also make minimum wage unless you get private request lessons and contrary to popular belief you rarely get tipped. You do get a free season pass and get to meet people to ride with but that's it.

A thing to note I did it while going to school full time actually. That being said I had to give up christmas breaks so I could work. resorts WILL NOT higher for spring season only. The most valuable times for them are the holidays and most resorts have their hiring done by mid November-early December at the latest. In fact resorts start limiting instructor hours and lessons by the end of February right after presidents day. Presidents day is often the last big push for resorts despite riding still going on for another month or two. Tons of fun but not gonna get you any real experience unless you do it for years.
 
#14 ·
Its good you have plans, goals and trying to figure it out...anything is possible. The thing is, bc guiding is a lifetime commitment that takes a lifetime to get competent and there is no short cut but to be in the environment. Imo being a bc guide takes being better than 90% of competent folks (not knobs)...skill, experience and maturity wise. You have folks relying on your competence and maturity and you are matched up against some hairy ass environment...that most reasonable people would not even consider.

Folks that want to heli into some bc perhaps have too much money, are adrenalin junkies and not well informed...thus they are relying on you to keep them out of trouble. Its not a typical easy job that just involves an internship and a few seasons...and unless you grew up on a gnarls hill you have a lot of catching up to do....like skiing/riding well, terrain, weather, snow knowledge and just mountaineering skills. This winter, met and rode with this 4 yr old girl/skier (has been skiing since 2) that did a decent job of ripping an off piste Baker double black...and when ur competing with folks that have this kind on mtn experience for some coveted heli job...its going to be difficult.

btw...most bc guides are skiers who might also board...perhaps an intermediate goal is to do some time as pro patrol at a gnarls hill.
 
#26 · (Edited)
Heli guide started skiing at 3 years old, in PNW & later Utah...


AARON’S ADVICE:

Do it for the right reasons, not because it sounds cool at the bar or you want to ski powder for a living. Be ok with living in a remote, inhospitable place.
Get as educated as possible. Take your courses, then apply the information. Go on overnight ski camping trips. Go ski in far-off places you don’t know anything about.
Make contacts in the industry. Make a strong first impression and come across as a professional.
You aren’t going to be a guide for awhile. It’s a desirable job with not a lot of turnover. It’s a profession that’s about seniority.







also, a little dose of reality here:


GUIDE TRAINING AND CAREER PROGRESSION
Level One:
This course is conducted in non-glaciated terrain and involves the use of lifts, snow cats, and helicopters, and is meant as a first step towards the career of ski guiding. Prerequisites: Advanced skiing/riding ability, advanced fitness level, advanced first aid training or OEC, avalanche awareness education.

Level Two:
This course is intended for advanced participants that have completed an AMSG LI or have equivalent industry experience. It is held in the heavily glaciated, big-mountain terrain of the Chugach Range of Alaska, and is a valuable and important step in the progression towards becoming a world-class heli-guide. The focus of level two is to allow participants as much time as possible using a helicopter to access this serious terrain. Prerequisites: AMSG LI, Wilderness First Responder/OEC, Level I avalanche training, advanced skiing ability, high level of fitness/injury free.

Aspirant Guide:
An AMSG Aspirant Guide is a working guide who furthers experience by working flight deck and fueling operations, coordinating rescue, and acting as a tail guide as needed. This is a crucial step in a successful guide’s learning process and completion of the AMSG LI & LII are significant steps towards securing this position. Prerequisites: AMSG LI & II, WFR/OEC/EMT, LI, II & III avalanche training, expert skiing ability, advanced rescue and mountaineering skills, high level of fitness.

Guide:
An AMSG Guide is an experienced team member who can bring considerable assets to the team. These guides also work as forecasters, are responsible for training of new team members, and take on a larger responsibility in all aspects of the company's operations. Prerequisites: Guides generally have more than 100 days guiding in that range, are advanced level III avalanche forecasters and educators, have extensive high angle and crevasse rescue training and are extremely fit, expert skier/riders.

Lead Guide:
An AMSG Lead guide is a highly experienced guide that understands all aspects of company operations. Lead guides oversee daily operations including operating area, run selection, efficient flight operations and adherence to all protocols. Prerequisites: An AMSG lead guide is an extremely experienced guide with several years working with a heli-guiding operation. These guides generally have more than 500 days as an Aspirant Guide or Guide, usually in that region or with that company. These guides have a highly elevated understanding of the mechanized ski industry and can function in any role necessary.



AMSG Instructors

Our instructor pool consists of a World Extreme Ski Champion, AMGA certified guides, career snow-safety advocates and a variety of industry professionals. Incorporating the experiences of nine seasons of mechanized guide schools and blending the skill sets of these world-class guides, the AMSG course is unparalleled in this industry. This is the only course of this nature that can offer instructors of this caliber, combined with a curriculum that has been evolving and progressing consistently for nine seasons.



the first course is almost $4,000 not including transportation food, lodging.
 
#27 ·
So you want to be a heli ski guide? - Freeskier

started skiing at 3 years old, in PNW & later Utah...



AARON’S ADVICE:

Do it for the right reasons, not because it sounds cool at the bar or you want to ski powder for a living. Be ok with living in a remote, inhospitable place.
Get as educated as possible. Take your courses, then apply the information. Go on overnight ski camping trips. Go ski in far-off places you don’t know anything about.
Make contacts in the industry. Make a strong first impression and come across as a professional.
You aren’t going to be a guide for awhile. It’s a desirable job with not a lot of turnover. It’s a profession that’s about seniority.
Teaching snowboarding at the right mountain and continuing your backcountry education in your time off will give you a better chance of being some kind of guide in the future than staying in the midwest.

FACT
 
#31 · (Edited)
you need to also have a lot of $$$$ to pay for the education, among all the other stuff. I don't think instructors make a ton of money, but whatever. Being an instructor, you tend to spend all your time around beginners. Not the best way to become an expert big mountain skier and mountaineer (I got this from looking at the prerequisites listed in my prior post)


this looks like a good starting point
 
#42 ·
One of my coworkers tried this, he graduated with a degree in engineering and tried to work as a BC guide, for skiing in the winter and also mountaineering/climbing in the summer. Didn't take long for him to realize the numbers didn't work. All I can say is, if you are leaving college with some debt and want to support yourself as a guide, good luck.
 
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