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about 'advanced' carving

17K views 65 replies 27 participants last post by  deagol 
#1 ·
How does one find more information to improve carving on a more all mountain/freestyle oriented setup (15/-15 stance)?

I can ride on an edge and make smooth arcs of pencil lines on the snow. I'm familiar with fore/aft movements, up unweighting, down unweighting, and cross-under turns. While carving I can probably keep the board angle at about 45 degrees if the condition is nice enough and the run is steep enough.

So I think I understand "basic carving". The thing is, I have never seen any discussions anywhere about how to improve beyond this type of carving. I don't even know whether if there's a point to learning beyond this type of carving. Like... does trying to become better than this help with freestyle, all mountain, or any aspects of riding?

I've seen people on a freestyle board setup that can somewhat mimic euro carving. They can ride almost with their body parallel to the ground and touch their hands on the snow. They wear soft boots and have similar park setups (something like 15/-9). So I know that my 'basic carving' can definitely be improved. But I just don't know whether if there's a point to it. And I don't know where to find the information... :dunno:
 
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#5 ·
I guess what I'm saying is I know of a few people that focus their entire time on the mountain "improving their carving". They can do some big/aggressive carves and keep their body close to the ground, which I cannot do. The best I can do is probably 45 degree angle to the snow when I carve down a steep groomed run.

I'm always down to learning new techniques if it improves my free riding or freestyle skills. But I am wondering whether if getting that specialized into carving is of any use to freestyle or freeride progression? And also, where can I find information beyond basic carving?
 
#4 ·
First thing you could change your angles to a +21 + 12, ride the board centered and see how it feels, eventually increasing angles to +31 + 18, and keep going.
 
#9 ·
Your question about the usefulness made me smile, cos that's what I'm sometimes thinking when I see kids slipping over features in the park :) Different strokes for different folks. It's not the question if improving carving helps with something else - the aim is faster, shorter, deeper, lower, smoother just for the fun of it.
I actually wanted to check if Canmanski (member here; softboot euro carver) from www.megustasport.com has not only reviwes but also teaching vids, but the site is down at the moment :dunno:
 
#11 ·
Basic carving is simply cranking the board onto an edge and riding out the carve according to the sidecut.

More advanced carving is where you start to play with fore/aft and influence the shape of the turn. For example at the very end of the turn you can use either some sudden aft pressure, or some rear foot pedal (or both) to turn back up the hill and launch you powerfully into the next turn.

In terms of edge angle, its very dependant on speed and just about every other factor is somewhat linked and your posture has a big influence on it too. There are also a few distinct carving techniques, from the euro carve style to a more inline and stacked type posture (as in my avatar). You absolutely can euro carve with a duck stance and soft boots/board. I find it way easier on the toes but I'm still learning. There's a couple of guys out here I've seen absolutely cranked over forearm running neatly over the snow, toe and heal. All on basic all mountain snowboard gear. Quite inspiring to watch. One of them, Ive seen do a complete tight 360 in a carve, flat to the snow from which he then came to rest back at the bottom of the loop by standing up and taking his board off like it wasn't even a thing. That's quiet an impressive way to arrive at a bar as it turns out.
 
#12 ·
Basic carving is simply cranking the board onto an edge and riding out the carve according to the sidecut.

More advanced carving is where you start to play with fore/aft and influence the shape of the turn. For example at the very end of the turn you can use either some sudden aft pressure, or some rear foot pedal (or both) to turn back up the hill and launch you powerfully into the next turn.
I understand the effect of fore/aft movements on the carves, but not really on the rear foot pedal thing. I know that turning/pressuring toes or heels separately during carves help with turning, but I don't know if that's the same as what you're talking about?

In terms of edge angle, its very dependant on speed and just about every other factor is somewhat linked and your posture has a big influence on it too. There are also a few distinct carving techniques, from the euro carve style to a more inline and stacked type posture (as in my avatar). You absolutely can euro carve with a duck stance and soft boots/board. I find it way easier on the toes but I'm still learning. There's a couple of guys out here I've seen absolutely cranked over forearm running neatly over the snow, toe and heal. All on basic all mountain snowboard gear. Quite inspiring to watch. One of them, Ive seen do a complete tight 360 in a carve, flat to the snow from which he then came to rest back at the bottom of the loop by standing up and taking his board off like it wasn't even a thing. That's quiet an impressive way to arrive at a bar as it turns out.
Yeah one person I've met mentioned to me that he's been taught to "throw his back arm and chest towards the nose of the board during heelside carves while digging deep into the carve with his ankles". Apparently that helps him with his carves. I have never heard this kind of technique before, which is one of the reasons I'm asking for more information out of curiosity.
 
#14 ·
Yeah basically peddling is effecting the edge tilt independently by torsionally twisting the board with one or both feet. By increasing the back foot pedal at the end of the turn, you are increasing the rear edge angle to be slightly more than the front and that helps steer the back of the board round and has a positive effect on grip as well. The aft pressure works similarly because you are in effect shortening the rear edge, which has the effect of simulating a tighter sidecut, thus tightening the turn. Timing becomes very important and you don't really need to worry too much about the fore pressure, if you get the aft right, you'll get enough fore as the reciprocal of the aft as you change edge. For example, on the toe edge, imagine giving your rear knee a little crank towards the snow just as you cross the fall line and want to change edge.

For the more euro style (as far as i understand it anyway) you actually use quite a lot of upper body rotation - by taking your rear arm and bringing it forward to the position where it will then rest on the snow. it feels quite sudden and the board really locks in and snaps around you, sort of forcing the aft pressure and giving insane grip through the carve. i can't really describe the steps well though. i found some good Youtube vids and a carving technique site at the start of the season. i'll dig them up and post because frankly most of the stuff on YouTube is nothing close to the eurocraving I've seen done.
 
#18 ·
1. Anyone that says you have to change your stance to 'aggressively carve' obviously doesn't understand how to carve.

2. Anyone that says long drawn out carves don't help your freestyle obviously doesn't understand the importance of edge control.

3. Like I said go forth and ride if you think you can carve it, then carve it, I strongly suggest watching a Yawgoons edit to see how they are carving and try to imitate that.
 
#19 ·
How does one find more information to improve carving on a more all mountain/freestyle oriented setup (15/-15 stance)?
Why would your ride duck stance if you're doing freeride carving? Seems like just the opposite of what you'd want to do. I like to "surf" and work the edges of the trails, working from big carving arcs to lip smacks off the banks and sides of the trails. I ride 15/0, which is pretty close to the way you'd ride a surfboard. Try out different settings, do what works best for you. But I think you'd get more carving power out of your back foot if you weren't riding duck.
 
#23 ·
Well while I'm inbound I like to do park laps and also do occasional ground tricks / butters. That means a duck stance is great.

But just because I do these doesn't mean that I don't enjoy carving. I've seen people that are able to carve well with a duck stance, so from that I know that I got lots of room for improvement. While I know that it's easier and probably more fun to carve on an actual freeride stance, I don't want to lose the versatility to play around in the park.
 
#20 ·
roun here you want to be able to do it all. i love come blastin out of deep pow woods onto the trail you need and laying right into a big deep toe carve. not many places are gonna have only one type of condition to deal with on a given run down. really good carving abilities, to whatever level you want to take it, are an essential part of the skillset. shocking and scandalous how many guys these days don't even know for sure what you mean when you say 'carve'
 
#26 ·
How does one find more information to improve carving on a more all mountain/freestyle oriented setup (15/-15 stance)?
Find a really top level instructor somewhere. I'm not a big fan of the video teaching technique... Cool to look at and get some ideas, but for what you're describing, you probably need somebody to look at what you're already doing.

FWIW, I ride duck, and like to carve like hell. Nothing like launching off a cat track, then riding some powder trees, then carving up the groomers all in the same run!

For anyone that thinks it's a waste of time: you're a waste of time. :cheeky4:
 
#27 ·
I guess I'm just a douche bag. I seem to get a lot more "pedal" power out of the back foot if it's 0 degrees or even more forward. I admit, I don't worry about transitioning to park…just freeride and tree runs. I ride a directional board and never worry about park. I like to be able to stomp the pedal to carve and get more speed, torque the board as others have said. But I can still ride the directional board board switch when conditions call for it.
 
#30 ·
:question: :WTF:

Look again!
 
#40 ·
...now you know why I use so many emoticons! :dunno: :D :blink:
 
#48 ·
Normally my stance is +12 -9, was testing different stances for slalom racing. Most extreme was +37 +27 . Finally finished with +21 +9 which allowed me to carve and ride switch. Not much different than my +12 -9 duck stance . Found that bindings and boots had more of an impact on my ability to carve than my stance. Someone who is an expert could lay down a carve on any board with almost any set-up. As a noobe in slalom and racing think I'll ride with a forward stance.
 
#51 · (Edited)
#53 ·
Looks like BA wins at the internet once again! :thumbsup: :D
 
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