Backfoot driver - Snowboarding Forum

ElPolloDiablo · 03-05-2012, 08:20 AM

Last weekend I was having some trouble and it felt like my back foot was taking over far more than usual. I haven't had a lot of trouble in the past (2nd year, probably 15th time out) with driving mainly with my front foot prior to this, but even when I consciously focused on driving turns with my front shin/calf, my back foot would at some point overpower my front edge and skid out.

There were a few differences this time out and I was hoping to get some opinions on if any of these could have lead to my issues. If you don't think these contributed, then any advice on how to counter act or at least what to watch for, would be appreciated.

1. New board - I went from a 159 Ride Agenda to a 161 Never Summer SL...The profile is different with the Ride being a "flat rocker" and the NS obviously being their RC

2. Binding angle - When I moved my bindings over to the new board, I went from a +15/-3 to a +12/-9 angle to test out a more even stance and to see if opening the back foot would alleviate pressure on my knees.

3. Snow - The day I was having the most trouble was raining in the morning and by lunch the trails we were riding were all nicely packed down and glossy. Edges felt tenuous at best.

Thanks for any feedback.

SnowMotion · 03-05-2012, 08:26 AM

One problem might be board size. most people go smaller when they go to rc shape. Binding angle might change it up a little but shouldn't make your edge slip out. I would try +15 -9. Also maybe widening your stance might drop you lower to the board giving you more grip.

ElPolloDiablo · 03-05-2012, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowolf

Since you indicate that you had not experienced this prior, I am going to highly suspect that is lack of familiarity with the new rocker profile. You are experiencing what a lot of people report when first trying this profile.

These boards are very subject to pivot and any rotational movement of the upper body can cause this. Do you notice a tendency for the tail to skid out in front of you more than behind? Riding with open shoulders in a countered stance can really cause some issues here. One thing if you find this to be true that helps is angling the back foot out more. I have found that with this profile, a symmetrical duck stance works best. I run 15/-18 (my right foot naturally kicks out more so I have more angle on the rear foot).

Another thing I am finding about any full rocker or the C2 style is that you need to use some fore aft movements. You could be staying forward too much and not shifting aft when needed. This will keep the tail light and subject to skidding out. Start your turn by shifting forward toward the nose and as you go into the control phase, begin to slowly shift aft so you complete the turn heavy on the rear foot.

Play with that and see how it goes....

Thanks for the feedback SnowMotion and Snowolf.

Regarding your question Snowolf, I was noticing on my toe side turns (I ride regular) that my upper torso would have a tendency to swing left and face down the mountain as my hips pivoted to the right across the mountain. When I consciously focused on keeping my shoulders parallel above my board I would turn REALLY fast (actually felt like I was picking up speed). If I didn’t think about it, I am sure I was using normal bad habits.

Something that I’ve never been really clear on is the timing of moving weight back from front foot weighting to even weighting. How far into the turn should this occur?

pdxrealtor · 03-07-2012, 10:02 AM

I was playing around with this yesterday and here's a couple things I found , I was having similar issues as you and also like you I've moved up from a 158 to a 162.

Stance width. The narrower I went the more washout I had on my back foot. The wider i went the less this was a problem. The next width wider was just to wide and wore my outer quads out to quickly. 23 1/2 vs. 22. Being as the wider width was too wide I started to work on the washout issue of the narrower stance.

As Sno mentioned above, I ducked out my back foot and it really helped keep my upper body more in line with the board. I'm now at +15/-15, I was at +15/-3.

This led to another problem and that is initiating a turn. I felt all messed up while cruising the blues. Damn near was catching edges. I can't remember where I read this, probably here. I put my hands behind my back and that's where they stayed no matter how much I wanted to move them. This solved my turn initiation problem. What I suspect is that at one point I got in the habit of leaning my body weight back, as well as open stance. Whatever it was, hands behind my back forced a proper body position and as a result the best feeling I had all day.

Hope this helps....

ElPolloDiablo · 03-07-2012, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pdxrealtor

I was playing around with this yesterday and here's a couple things I found , I was having similar issues as you and also like you I've moved up from a 158 to a 162.

Stance width. The narrower I went the more washout I had on my back foot. The wider i went the less this was a problem. The next width wider was just to wide and wore my outer quads out to quickly. 23 1/2 vs. 22. Being as the wider width was too wide I started to work on the washout issue of the narrower stance.

As Sno mentioned above, I ducked out my back foot and it really helped keep my upper body more in line with the board. I'm now at +15/-15, I was at +15/-3.

This led to another problem and that is initiating a turn. I felt all messed up while cruising the blues. Damn near was catching edges. I can't remember where I read this, probably here. I put my hands behind my back and that's where they stayed no matter how much I wanted to move them. This solved my turn initiation problem. What I suspect is that at one point I got in the habit of leaning my body weight back, as well as open stance. Whatever it was, hands behind my back forced a proper body position and as a result the best feeling I had all day.

Hope this helps....

This is all very interesting information. Thanks for posting it. Out of curiousity, how tall are you?

I will give the hands a try. It will likely address other things in addition to the shoulder position, as I am fairly certain I was bending forward at the waist...which likely didn't help matters.

pdxrealtor · 03-07-2012, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElPolloDiablo

This is all very interesting information. Thanks for posting it. Out of curiousity, how tall are you?

I will give the hands a try. It will likely address other things in addition to the should position, as I am fairly certain I was bending forward at the waist...which likely didn't help matters.

I'm 5'8" 195-200 lbs.

outlyr · 03-07-2012, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElPolloDiablo

2. Binding angle - When I moved my bindings over to the new board, I went from a +15/-3 to a +12/-9 angle to test out a more even stance and to see if opening the back foot would alleviate pressure on my knees.

Opening up your back foot can also cause your rear knee to flex awkwardly. If your most recent angles don't solve the problem, or if you develop knee pain from the "pressure" try opening up the front to +21 and shift the rear back to -3. Like a previous poster said, you might find that the issue resolves itself when you become more accustomed to the R/C.

03-05-2012, 08:20 AM	#1 (permalink)
ElPolloDiablo Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: SE New England Posts: 12	Backfoot driver Last weekend I was having some trouble and it felt like my back foot was taking over far more than usual. I haven't had a lot of trouble in the past (2nd year, probably 15th time out) with driving mainly with my front foot prior to this, but even when I consciously focused on driving turns with my front shin/calf, my back foot would at some point overpower my front edge and skid out. There were a few differences this time out and I was hoping to get some opinions on if any of these could have lead to my issues. If you don't think these contributed, then any advice on how to counter act or at least what to watch for, would be appreciated. 1. New board - I went from a 159 Ride Agenda to a 161 Never Summer SL...The profile is different with the Ride being a "flat rocker" and the NS obviously being their RC 2. Binding angle - When I moved my bindings over to the new board, I went from a +15/-3 to a +12/-9 angle to test out a more even stance and to see if opening the back foot would alleviate pressure on my knees. 3. Snow - The day I was having the most trouble was raining in the morning and by lunch the trails we were riding were all nicely packed down and glossy. Edges felt tenuous at best. Thanks for any feedback.

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03-05-2012, 08:26 AM	#2 (permalink)
SnowMotion Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 224	One problem might be board size. most people go smaller when they go to rc shape. Binding angle might change it up a little but shouldn't make your edge slip out. I would try +15 -9. Also maybe widening your stance might drop you lower to the board giving you more grip.

03-07-2012, 10:02 AM	#4 (permalink)
pdxrealtor Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 750	I was playing around with this yesterday and here's a couple things I found , I was having similar issues as you and also like you I've moved up from a 158 to a 162. Stance width. The narrower I went the more washout I had on my back foot. The wider i went the less this was a problem. The next width wider was just to wide and wore my outer quads out to quickly. 23 1/2 vs. 22. Being as the wider width was too wide I started to work on the washout issue of the narrower stance. As Sno mentioned above, I ducked out my back foot and it really helped keep my upper body more in line with the board. I'm now at +15/-15, I was at +15/-3. This led to another problem and that is initiating a turn. I felt all messed up while cruising the blues. Damn near was catching edges. I can't remember where I read this, probably here. I put my hands behind my back and that's where they stayed no matter how much I wanted to move them. This solved my turn initiation problem. What I suspect is that at one point I got in the habit of leaning my body weight back, as well as open stance. Whatever it was, hands behind my back forced a proper body position and as a result the best feeling I had all day. Hope this helps....