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Discussion Starter #61
The shorter board with large sidecut thing sounds interesting, as long as the snow is right. Alot of the heelside turns look ugly when going so low and tight on regular boards, they just chatter up and skid out.
The main difference is that the board need not flex so much. Thats why I can draw great big perfect C shapes even when I lay it down, on a more regular board I would be biting in hard at the start of the turn simply due to the mechanics of tilting a long edge, short radius board. The short edge, long radius board will produce the large turn shape we want without so much crazy stuff going on all over the place. Simplification...
 

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Discussion Starter #62
I woke up this morning, tried to stretch and sat my ass on the ground. I could not reach my trail arm across my chest to touch the ground. I have Trex arms :(

I definitely get low enough on my turns but I just keep my trail arm off the snow lol.

Another thing my little arms cant do is reach my front edge while doing a heelside turn. It just doesn't work :crying:

...but I'm ok with it...

These problems pale in comparison to my issues in cycling... long torso and stubby limbs are a nightmare when it comes to proper bike fit. Wound up having a custom frame built
Can we call you T-rex?:grin:
 

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Discussion Starter #63 (Edited)
Interesting idea but negative setback seems counter to the prevailing carving wisdom and my own intuition. All of the dedicated carver bros I know embrace boards with setback, stiff noses, and ample camber.
My rationale for being in front of the radius is that I find shifting weight back is easy, shifting weight forward is harder for me, perhaps 60% of my energy is going into getting forward, 40% into getting back. (Gravity?)

So I as move my stance forward in relation to the sidecut radius I effectively share the work load more evenly. Throughout a turn my body weight will be in exactly the same place as before, only the amount of work I had to do to get there has changed, now it will be more effort to get back, less effort to get forward than it was before. We are closer to a 50-50 energy split which is my aim.
 

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Discussion Starter #64
Cool. Thanks for the insight into what you're doing. Definitely food for thought, and stuff to try.

What you say resonates. Last year or so I've found my front shoulder to be my focus. I can't quantify my body movements nearly as well as you can, but I find when I'm in balance just moving the shoulder, just a few inches, can control the whole carve. Granted, the rest of the body knows what to do, but the shoulder is all that I need to initiate.



Glad I'm not alone there as well, lol.
You get it !:jumping1::jumping1:
 

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Discussion Starter #65
Is there a link of op eurocarving video in this post or I just missed it?
There is a link of a heel side turn on about page 3 or 4 but to be honest Im not really looking to put pics and vids of myself snowboarding all over the thread, that just lets it slip further into the "I dont like this or that" comment spiral from people who really aren`t here to actually try it. Those who do try it will find a wealth of info from not only myself but other keen carvers who post up what works for them.

We are working, not showing off :grin:
 

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Discussion Starter #66
The two hand drag looks wack. Bending forward at the waist looks wack. These fall into the category of "trying too hard." The bend you want is more like a side bend, where you move your uphill shoulder toward toward your knees at the beginning of the turn. While you're doing this you're loading your weight onto the nose of the board. At the same time you're decambering and tipping the board up on its edge. This combination of movements allows you to make the turn without losing your speed. Once you're traveling across the fall line aand holding sufficient speed you can stretch out if the mood strikes you. Or you can light a cigarette, work on your rubix cube, check your phone, adjust your junk, etc.

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Exactly. This is why I stress that getting dynamic before you even start to try laying it down is so important.
My silly little dance (that nobody has paid attention to yet lol) lets me put all that stuff in a set of brackets and forget about it. I watch friends go straight for the money shot and its all bent over at the waist reaching for the snow. I tell them to wait till they feel their knee touching the snow its time to start laying down.
 

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Discussion Starter #68 (Edited)
Now that sounds interesting. May help with heelside deep carving.

Nice string of videos on this thread. Loving it.

Also, @Kijima I think you need a separate board manufacturing thread.....
Thats why I found myself playing with an idea that goes directly against conventional thinking(being front of sidecut). I tried it and I like it.
 

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The Swiss Miss
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Loads of good info in this thread, also for non-euro carving. I really like those mind pictures used (like grid, joystick, cockpit), as they can serve as mantras on the slope.

The main take home message to me is that it pays off to put thoughts into one's and others riding, analysing the good and bad, etc. Learning is a neverending process. And if you don't get it with method A, check, if you find another method which works for you. And/or create your own one.

I just spent hrs watching n comparing my moves to those of other, better riders, to find out what my problems with a certain motion are. Only by compiling the info of several sources, I think I have a trace now. Next time on slope, I think I'll learn something new :).


My silly little dance (that nobody has paid attention to yet lol)
Will do, here you go, lol.

Ok guys here goes.
...
I doing my little dolphin dance.
After an initial smirk, I actually like the dolphin mind picture.

I often use the mind pic of "diving into a line" for getting into the cockpit when riding steeps in bc, but haven't used it ever for carving. And as I tend to be late with my knee/push motion in long drawn out carves, I will try next time, if imagining being a dolphin helps to improve that timing (as weird as it sounds, lol).

With that said, I've always learned something from messing with board setup. New setups make me really pay attention to inputs and feedback.
True. Some days, having a screwdriver in ones pocket and shift n try n shift n try are awesome to figure stuff out. Even boards which last year, or at the beginning of year were set up a certain way, I like to play with setback/shift of binding to toe or heel, angles, later in the season, since I may have learned something meanwhile, and now may prefer a slight different set-up.

The short edge, long radius board will produce the large turn shape we want without so much crazy stuff going on all over the place. Simplification...
Sounds interesting. How much would a long radius be if you think of women's boards? (For 24.5cm feet). The one with the biggest radius I have is a Jones Hovy 150, ww 24.7, r 7.9. I assume that's not yet what you mean?
 

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Thats why I found myself playing with an idea that goes directly against conventional thinking(being front of sidecut). I tried it and I like it.
I tried some "setfront" on a C2 (Lib) board once, didn't work at all, but depends on boards, have done fakie riding on directional setback cambers, and that works ok. Moss is making the Wingpin with an option like that (maybe a bit exaggerated to simulate longboarding?), don't know if that works the same way.

Have you tried reverse taper as well? I made a board with that a few years ago. Was fine for powder with alot of setback, but I noticed how it affected turns on groomers too when I centered the stance more. Could have some of the effect you are after. Noticed the Elevated Surfcraft brand put some boards with it into production as well, but I haven't found any of those to try out.
 

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I tried some "setfront" on a C2 (Lib) board once, didn't work at all, but depends on boards, have done fakie riding on directional setback cambers, and that works ok. Moss is making the Wingpin with an option like that (maybe a bit exaggerated to simulate longboarding?), don't know if that works the same way.

Have you tried reverse taper as well? I made a board with that a few years ago. Was fine for powder with alot of setback, but I noticed how it affected turns on groomers too when I centered the stance more. Could have some of the effect you are after. Noticed the Elevated Surfcraft brand put some boards with it into production as well, but I haven't found any of those to try out.
Setback and set front on C2-type profiles is a topic in itself. These profiles are very sensitive to weight distribution/location and getting it wrong works adversely against edge hold. Which we want.

The Dupraz D1 is actually set front. And note how Fielding mentioned it as a solid carving ripper. And it is. BUT the D1 is full camber. I could play around with setback and set front on it and it slightly changed the board's behaviour.... nothing dramatic. In my case I used it at reference (set front) and it was great for going fast. Kept your tail LOCKED no matter what and very stable. Set back was nicer for mellower more forgiving riding.

I typically add setback on my boards that don't already come with a heavy dose of it. But that's because I'm not aiming to maximize groomer performance and even with some setback, they're still awesome on groomers. Example: Archetype and Flight Attendant... i set them up all the way to the back of the channel. Still rip. And float.

Boards like Fish, landlord, Stun Gun which are heavily setback, I ride at reference. But a lot of people in other forums ride these boards slightly set-front and get great results. It's because they're camber boards.

One thing with the Landlord is the same thing mentioned above about small radius sidecuts and long-ish freeride-based eff edge. That board is excellent, but i know I am compromising long radius groomer turns... there's always some little hiccup as I fight the sidecut when going faster and with more tilt. The Archetype does not. It LOCKS. But i still prefer riding the LL for other reasons...
 

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Discussion Starter #73 (Edited)
Sounds interesting. How much would a long radius be if you think of women's boards? (For 24.5cm feet). The one with the biggest radius I have is a Jones Hovy 150, ww 24.7, r 7.9. I assume that's not yet what you mean?
You rode my 10m radius pow board with no problem and that has a longer edge length, a shorter edge length is easier to control, as is a board with more flex between the feet, so what you accomplished on that board in short time shows you need not worry about being able to handle ANY board. I see the speed at which you progress when you put your mind into it, far more than most men I know.
So. . . Neni, the Swiss Miss, you basically kill it on a snowboard, you need only a tad more flex as you weigh less. When you stand on a board you make the same triangle as I do, you are the same joy stick that I am, your shoulders rotate just as mine do. A similar board will produce a similar result. It took me 3 days to get comfortable on that new wide board, now its a toy at my feet and I have a whole new range of options in my snowboarding because of it.:laugh2:

Mountain size has a lot to do with it too, My 12m radius is great on these wide runs but you wouldnt want that on a skinny run. Im building a super wide 8m radius today so peeps can try width without having to learn a new radius at the same time
1m edge length 8m radius. it will be interesting to ride the 2 boards back to back.
 

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Discussion Starter #74
I tried some "setfront" on a C2 (Lib) board once, didn't work at all, but depends on boards, have done fakie riding on directional setback cambers, and that works ok. Moss is making the Wingpin with an option like that (maybe a bit exaggerated to simulate longboarding?), don't know if that works the same way.

Have you tried reverse taper as well? I made a board with that a few years ago. Was fine for powder with alot of setback, but I noticed how it affected turns on groomers too when I centered the stance more. Could have some of the effect you are after. Noticed the Elevated Surfcraft brand put some boards with it into production as well, but I haven't found any of those to try out.
I only try the things that present themselves to me as problems, so far Ive not had a problem that reverse taper was the answer to so I never ended up there .0:)
 

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Discussion Starter #75
One thing that my dolphin dance does for me is it automatically gets me bending my knees at the right time. That natural curve that a dolphin swims with is how I visualize my body movements, its an up and down rhythm. When we add up and down rhythm to our turn we become dynamic.

Create the muscle memories.
Put a set of brackets around your new skills and put them in your tool box. (What new skills right?)
Enjoy reaching into your tool box as you progress
:nerd:
 

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Discussion Starter #76
Watching Ryans how to really really carve #11 you can see Giri Watts popping up at the end of his heel turn as prep for the toe turn. It's the same thing I do.
He even puts 2 hands down heelside as his upper body rotation improves throughout the sequence of turns. Shock horror lol.

The reason his turns look so different to Ryans is that he is obviously on a small radius sidecut which robs him of time in the turn.
 

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Discussion Starter #77
Well the season is done for me now peeps so I wish you all the best learning to lay it down. Tape up your shit BEFORE it gets full of holes lol.

I managed to exceed my goals this season by working hard but thinking harder. I went from petting the dog to linking lay downs on both sides in about 6 weeks by studying, trying and modifying my body movements.

I managed to snap this shot of my first line in the morning.

 

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Well the season is done for me now peeps so I wish you all the best learning to lay it down. Tape up your shit BEFORE it gets full of holes lol.

I managed to exceed my goals this season by working hard but thinking harder. I went from petting the dog to linking lay downs on both sides in about 6 weeks by studying, trying and modifying my body movements.

I managed to snap this shot of my first line in the morning.

Mmmm. Nice.
 
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