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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This season, I updated my setup that I had been riding since 2004(!!!) I was way overdue for some new gear, granted, some years I only got out twice, and there were a few years I did not get out at all due to an injury (unrelated to snowboarding). I ended up picking up a new Burton Custom (camber), with Genesis bindings and Photon boots. I am riding at the reference stance (which is setback), and am using +15, -10 as my angles. I am on the ice (east) coast. I would put my skill level at intermediate.

I've been out 3 times this season, and notice I have been struggling on easier terrain on my heel side. I am not talking about situations where I am carving, but cases where I do a quick speed check or decide to skid a turn. I am not sure in these cases if I am leaning too far back, or not leaning back far enough, or maybe I need to adjust the pressure on my back/front foot? To be honest, it has never been something I really thought about on my old board. Yesterday, I did the same run 3 times, and 2 of the 3 times I fell in a very similar spot, in very similar snow conditions. It was a flatter spot near the top of the run and it wasn't THAT icy, it was just pretty hard pack. The rest of the run was fine, and the sections where I picked up some speed felt great. I did some (nowhere near perfect) carving with skidded transitions in a few spots that also felt good.

I know it is probably something with my posture, I just can't figure it out. I am keeping my knees bent (not bending at waist), and I keep washing out on my heel edge whenever I hit any type of hard packed snow/ice on easier terrain while I am in the middle of a speed check/skid. In all of the cases where it happened, I was not even going that fast. Some of the runs have been slightly crowded, and since I am on a new setup, I've been trying to slow things down until I feel more comfortable (the crowd also makes doing wider carves a little more difficult). As soon as I hit a spot of hard pack/ice while I am doing a speed check/skid, I hear that dreaded scraping sound and wash out. When it happened yesterday, it wasn't even chatter, it was just a single scraping sound. I never really had this problem on my old board unless hitting a legit patch of thick ice. The answer very well could be "dude just carve", but I am trying to figure/troubleshoot out why I am having this specific issue and fix it. Toe side feels great and I can really dig that edge in.

I know this isn't a ton of information, I am just looking for a list of things I might want to consider and try next time I am out. I know it is probably a combination of things, and I want to make progress. I've fallen more times this season than in the last 6 or 7 years combined, all heel side skid/speed checking. My bet is that it is something that I was never doing right before, but my old board was more forgiving. I appreciate any help/tips/points you can give.
 

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Are your boots centered on the board in the bindings? Maybe they're shifted too far toeside.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Are your boots centered on the board in the bindings? Maybe they're shifted too far toeside.

With the EST bindings and the channel system, there is an indicator that has a thick red line, and 2 smaller black lines. The thick red line marks when the binding is centered, but once I put my boots in (10.5), I moved the binding towards the heel side of the board as far as it would go so that the toe and heel overhang was about equal. That was my first day out on the board, and I was experiencing the skid out. Conditions were bad that first day, and the second day I went out with that same setup, conditions were better and I skidded out less, but still had it happen. This last time I went, I tried moving it back to the thick red line (binding centered), which gave me more toe overhang than heel. Still experienced the skid out heel side, and I think I need to move it back just a little bit based on how that felt.

(If any of the information I provided was wrong, please correct me because this is my first time using the channel and est bindings!)
 

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With the EST bindings and the channel system, there is an indicator that has a thick red line, and 2 smaller black lines. The thick red line marks when the binding is centered, but once I put my boots in (10.5), I moved the binding towards the heel side of the board as far as it would go so that the toe and heel overhang was about equal. That was my first day out on the board, and I was experiencing the skid out. Conditions were bad that first day, and the second day I went out with that same setup, conditions were better and I skidded out less, but still had it happen. This last time I went, I tried moving it back to the thick red line (binding centered), which gave me more toe overhang than heel. Still experienced the skid out heel side, and I think I need to move it back just a little bit based on how that felt.

(If any of the information I provided was wrong, please correct me because this is my first time using the channel and est bindings!)
You want the mid line of your foot over the midline of the board. The bindings are there to make that stacking your foot over the mid line happen. Once you get that set up, be mindful of adding to the stack, your hips and shoulders. See creepy basement vid.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
You want the mid line of your foot over the midline of the board. The bindings are there to make that stacking your foot over the mid line happen. Once you get that set up, be mindful of adding to the stack, your hips and shoulders. See creepy basement vid.
Thanks for the tip! I kept reading to check and measure toe and heel overhang, so that is what I was doing. Do the images of my setup above look terribly off center? That was before I moved it back to the red line.
 

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For reference, this is how it looked when set to the farthest back setting (not the red line):
View attachment 161080 View attachment 161082
Definitely heel heavy...imo. When you ride, you want an equal bias of response between engaging heel and toe. When you have that fulcrum point, you can feel it and will have a very subtle and quick response going toe to heel or heel to toe. If you feel a lag or latency or catchiness on one edge...adjust.
 

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Thanks for the tip! I kept reading to check and measure toe and heel overhang, so that is what I was doing. Do the images of my setup above look terribly off center? That was before I moved it back to the red line.
You are measuring the wrong thing....stack over the midline. Don't worry about overhang...that rarely comes in to play unless you have huge feet, on a narrow board, on a traversing 45+ degree slope or doing high angled carves.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
You are measuring the wrong thing....stack over the midline. Don't worry about overhang...that rarely comes in to play unless you have huge feet, on a narrow board, on a traversing 45+ degree slope or doing high angled carves.
Thanks, this is very helpful!
 

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Another reason might be your technique, like often a rider would keep the weight on its front foot and would not shift its weight onto the back foot during the turn. Then nose of the board wants to travel uphill and the edge angle is quite high, but the tail is flat and cannot follow the nose or even bite into the snow. From outside a rider would look like he rides with its front hip pushed forward and pretty straight front leg. The remedy is a short aggressive movement like pushing the snowboard underneath you with your back leg towards your front leg, also helps more forward lean on the back leg, or simply bending your back leg more than your front one
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
You want the mid line of your foot over the midline of the board. The bindings are there to make that stacking your foot over the mid line happen. Once you get that set up, be mindful of adding to the stack, your hips and shoulders. See creepy basement vid.
I just watched the creepy basement video (wasn't sure what that was at first, I am new here haha), and I already see a few things I need to adjust. This was very, very helpful, thank you!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Definitely heel heavy...imo. When you ride, you want an equal bias of response between engaging heel and toe. When you have that fulcrum point, you can feel it and will have a very subtle and quick response going toe to heel or heel to toe. If you feel a lag or latency or catchiness on one edge...adjust.
I haven't had a chance to get out again this week (should have time next week), but I just wanted to quickly follow up and say that things are starting to click after watching the creepy basement video. Never thought I would type that sentence.

One thing I wanted to add: when I got my old board in 2004, I was a total newbie, and I let the shop know and had them set it up for a beginner. I was also a lot younger, and I just wanted to get out and didn't really care about all of this stuff. I rode that board the same way for all of these years and never made any adjustments. When I got my new board, I did a lot of research, and setup my board for +15/-15 originally, but that felt a little off to me the first day I rode it, so I changed it to +15/-10.

Anyway, I pulled out my old board yesterday just to see what kind of angles I had on it, and was shocked that both were positive. Just by looking at them, my guess is that they were setup +15(ish)/+3. I strapped into the old board and noted how I was positioned. The first thing I realized is that on my new board, I was trying to mimic that position that I was used to. I should say, I was trying to mimic the "feel" of that position.

I then got my new board out, went in front of the mirror, and looked at how that had me stacked. I was shocked that even though the muscle memory had me thinking "this is your normal position", with the new board, I was not centered. It wasn't totally obvious at a flat/neutral stance or even in a toe side stance, but once I tried to mimic a heel side turn and I watched in the mirror what my body was doing, it became clear that one big mistake I was making was not being stacked properly over the heel edge. (Mind you, I wasn't really getting on edge because I was on a carpet, but I was mimicking the body movements from memory that I would do if I were on snow).

I felt stupid getting all of my gear out yesterday and setting up in front of a mirror, but I am so glad I did. I never would have noticed this otherwise because like I said, I felt like I was doing everything right from muscle memory. Next time I can coordinate a day out with a friend, I will have them shoot some video too.

I know what changes I need to make, I just need to get over the muscle memory. I am sure it won't be as simple as standing in front of a mirror on solid ground not moving at all, but at least I know where to start.

Huge thanks to you, @wrathfuldeity!
 

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Are you going back to ++ angles? I would. There's not much reason to ride duck stance unless you need that kind of symmetry. You can absolutely ride switch with ++ angles.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Are you going back to ++ angles? I would. There's not much reason to ride duck stance unless you need that kind of symmetry. You can absolutely ride switch with ++ angles.
I think I am going to try to leave them at +15/-10 this season to see if I can adjust my stance properly. To be honest, I rarely rode switch on the old board because it felt so awkward with how my feet were positioned.

I feel like my style up until this point has also been pretty straightforward, vanilla resort rider. I am intrigued by the idea of trying out more side hits and maybe some simple tricks, but I have no intention of doing any of that until I get my posture issues sorted out. With that said, I don't plan to do anything too crazy because I am not as young as I used to be... (and it is hard to get out as much as I would like to)
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I was able to get out yesterday, and what an awesome day it was. I made a couple of posture adjustments thanks to the basement vid that helped significantly, but I also think part of the reason I didn't lose my heel edge was due to the conditions. We got a significant amount of snow over the past couple of days, and I only hit a few hard packed spots. It wasn't a pow day, but there was a lot of soft snow. It was awesome, especially compared to the ice we just had 2 weeks ago.

I also adjusted my back binding to -6, and I made sure the center of my boots were centered with the board.
 
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