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Discussion Starter #1
Hello!

Not sure if this is a huge problem for anyone but:

I recently bought some union contacts (absolutely love them), and I've rotated the highbacks to match the 15/-15 angle I primarily ride, but I've noticed that because of the rotation, the lower part of the highback angles inward and bites pretty harshly into my boots.

The bindings are a size medium and I wear size 10 Burton Ambush boots, and after a long day of riding, there is an obvious dent in the boot. Will the highback eventually bore a hole into the boot? Just wondering if its worth rotating the highback at all if it'll compromise my boots : (

The attached pic is the part that digs into my boot
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yeah I was thinking about not even rotating. I know contacts are pretty soft and flexy anyway so just wanted to see if there was a consensus on their rotation mechanism. Meeeeehhhh
 

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Yeah I was thinking about not even rotating. I know contacts are pretty soft and flexy anyway so just wanted to see if there was a consensus on their rotation mechanism. Meeeeehhhh
Not sure if you noticed, but those highbacks are asymmetrical, meaning, there is less material on the inside of the highback. The reason is to minimize highback bite.

Personally, I suggest keeping the highbacks in the middle holes.

Thanks for the support.
 

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Not sure if you noticed, but those highbacks are asymmetrical, meaning, there is less material on the inside of the highback. The reason is to minimize highback bite.

Personally, I suggest keeping the highbacks in the middle holes.

Thanks for the support.
This still doesn't address the problem for people who *do* rotate the highbacks. They are made to be rotated, but rotating them increases the likelihood of them digging into boots. That might be something worth looking into as far as future product improvements, rather than just suggesting that even though the highbacks can rotate, people should just not do it...

All of my Union bindings (Force, Contact, Flite Pro) do dig into my boots, but the wear has been minimal -- I credit the build quality of the boots for this. That said, I do have other bindings (Rome, Burton, Salomon, Now, Rossignol) with which this isn't an issue at all or is less pronounced (although the Now highbacks are fixed so they don't really count).
 

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This still doesn't address the problem for people who *do* rotate the highbacks. They are made to be rotated,
No, they are not made to be rotated. While it is possible/an option, the highbacks are not meant/intended to be rotated.
 

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How do you figure that? What are the the holes for, then, and why do their installation guides show how to do it?

https://www.unionbindingcompany.com/how-to-set-your-union-bindings

Step 13: To adjust the highback, simply remove the screw on each side (two total) where the highback meets the ankle straps. If so desired, this allows the highback to rotate within the heelcup becoming parallel to the edge of the board.


The installation instructions don't support your suggestion, and UNION_INHOUSE, in his response, didn't even try to suggest that; all (s)he did was suggest keeping them in the centre holes.

I like Union bindings -- I have six pairs of them -- but I'm not paid by them or given free anything by them and I'm not going to defend a weak point in their design rather than suggesting that they try to improve it.
 

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How do you figure that? What are the the holes for, then, and why do their installation guides show how to do it?

https://www.unionbindingcompany.com/how-to-set-your-union-bindings

Step 13: To adjust the highback, simply remove the screw on each side (two total) where the highback meets the ankle straps. If so desired, this allows the highback to rotate within the heelcup becoming parallel to the edge of the board.


The installation instructions don't support your suggestion, and UNION_INHOUSE, in his response, didn't even try to suggest that; all (s)he did was suggest keeping them in the centre holes.

I like Union bindings -- I have six pairs of them -- but I'm not paid by them or given free anything by them and I'm not going to defend a weak point in their design rather than suggesting that they try to improve it.
I wrote that copy, so I'm well aware. I was only giving my personal 2 cents regarding HB rotation. Only one person at the company rotates, and none of our pros rotate either.

I don't see us changing that design in the near future though, at least till we design a new baseplate. Right now our focus is on improving straps, hardware and overall durability.

I appreciate the feedback guys.
 

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I'm not really sure what the benefit of rotating highbacks is anyway. Unless you plan on leaning into your corners really hard, this seems like a non-issue. Highbacks are meant for lateral heel edge control, not diagonal.

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
 

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interesting to read the thoughts about Union in general, both on this forum, and on this thread. i must say, i've never been tempted by Union products - when they first came out and all the cool kids were rocking them here in Australia, i didn't see how they were doing anything better than say Burton, Ride, Rome, Now, or Flux [ESPECIALLY not Flux]. like, i get that you need the coolest brands to go with your too-long jacket [that you need to hike up on run-ins to jumps] and tight girlpants, but yeah....

that being said, how important is highback rotation to you? is it a deal breaker? personally, i feel that whether or not highback rotation will result in wear to your boots, has to a lot to do with the design of the binding itself, e.g.
* Now's ride great, but you can't even rotate the highback to begin with
* with my Flux DS, it's either you rotate the highback as best you can, or the forward lean as best you can - can't really have both, IMO
* my Malavitas are near perfect, when it comes to setting your highback rotation without any adverse effects on your boots
* my K2 Liens were DEFINITELY designed with highback rotation in mind - hell, if i rotated so that the high back was in line with my angles [and not the edge of the board], i reckon the leftover tabs on the bottom of the highback might actually dig into my boots.

do the bindings ride fine WITHOUT highback rotation, in spite of rotation ability being built into the bindings? if so, sweet! if you find yourself missing the rotation, turf 'em, and get something from a brand who don't recommend you use don't use don't not use locktite on your bindings :p
 

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I slept on my original post last nights night. The more I think of this issue the more it pisses me off. This isn’t right. You sell to market a product and provide directions to move the high backs yet you state their not suppose to be moved! That’s absurd. To me this is a cover up for a crappy design you know about but are not addressing. I spend on me and my kids well over $5K annually on new equipment every year because we love the sport. You are the only company that has ever left a bad taste in my mouth in the industry. I work hard for my money and spend it carefully after a lot of research on everything I buy.

Union I’d like to be contacted and this matter addressed by replacing the defective product. This is my second attempt. You will know the shop I bought these, well known. They will have purchase records confirming. I either want these replaced with a non defective product or a credit at the shop.
 

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I tried rotating the highback too first time I got mine, but quickly figured out that it would be a problem, so just let it be centered. With the Contact Pro that worked, but don't think I would have done that with a stiffer binding with the angles I ride.
 

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Union I’d like to be contacted and this matter addressed by replacing the defective product. This is my second attempt. You will know the shop I bought these, well known. They will have purchase records confirming. I either want these replaced with a non defective product or a credit at the shop.
ooh, shots have been fired!

*easiest = write off the measly cost of a pair of bindings, give the gent some store credit, be done with the headache / avoid bad reviews and word of mouth [you don't want to gamble on what kind of day an irate customer has had]. retain the possibility of return custom [thanks to good service], when the design is sorted out down the track. potentially add his kids [plus more] to customer base in future.
* moderate = replace the bindings, knowing that the defect is in the design itself, and get ready for round two!
* i want to dance / let's put WAY too much value on one single item we've sold, that is realistically NOTHING to us = ignore / stall / push back on a customer who doesn't seem like he's gonna let this lie. not putting up new bindings / credit IS worth the email barrage + relentless negative reviews + bad word of mouth + losing a customer [and every potential customer that is in his social group] for life.

i'm intrigued to see how this will play out.
 

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This is a common problem for high back rotation among many brands. Not to mention the high back will not seat well in the heel loop once rotated. Another negative to rotating is the highback will no longer make full contact with the boot, especially if the highback is narrow.

Burton seems to have a slightly better solution for this adjustment from what I have seen.

I rotated my highbacks for years so I could run more forward lean. If I didn't rotate them the medial portion of the highback would create a pressure point on my leg. Last winter was the first time I did not rotate them because I decreased my angles (12/-12) and I eased up on forward lean. Also, many highbacks are designed to flex more at the top and some are pre-rotated slightly. I rode Contact Pros, Forces, and 390 Bosses un-rotated without issue.

If you really like them rotated, you can trim off the portion of the highback that is digging into the boot. Get out the Dremel and remove material sparingly. I did this to a pair of Unions, links to pics below http://s651.photobucket.com/user/jaredpabis/media/IMAG2207_zpsac2nb4d4.jpg.html
http://s651.photobucket.com/user/jaredpabis/media/IMAG2209_zpsaiqhcrnq.jpg.html
 

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I don't want to get between you and the company. Fight your fight. They have always treated me well, both directly and through their European supplier (C3, I think. It was years ago). Union bindings on all my boards, minus the split. I'd back channel them. Open forum threats/conversations might not be the most effective. Then again, what do I know?

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk
 
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