[zc1]

...I can’t see an application for these boards on narrow firm VT trails. Yes there’s tons of banks to ride, uneven groomers and of course Peace Parks at Killington but that firm snow gives me pause.

FWIW those definitely aren't the conditions I'd intentionally ride a snowsurf board in.

 

[Nolefan2011]

Ignore the specs.

I guess I meant, are you only getting half the experience with the pin tail that you would get if you went and bought a jelly fish?

 

[Rip154]

Jelly fish is just that, it's a really playful board with center rocker, almost like banana/flying v and so on. It's carvy big brother with similar specs is the fluffy. I wouldn't say half the experience, but the boards have almost an opposite profile of the pintail, which is more camrock or backseat camber, so it just depends what you like more. If you just move with the terrain and use edges to turn instead of braking/sliding, you can get away with alot of different boards. Might have to control speed more than pointing it and speedchecking, but thats not how I see the snowsurf style anyways.

 

[Nolefan2011]

I’m a big mountain guy these days, and just don’t know if these boards will ever be me. Maybe at 55 or so (currently 41)

 

[kimchijajonshim]

Goes both ways. Lib Tech's (and many others) dribbles machine-translated to completely broken Japanese/Chinese/Korean are par for the course in those markets. I think Moss and Gentem deliberately skewed their copies to sound less.. um... zen. At least it's natural human language.

That's a separate issue, though. Moss and Gentem copy is grammatically correct English that says nothing of substance. I'd rather have broken English that actually tells me something. The TJ Brand English copy is a masterclass in Engrlish, but it's close enough that I can follow along and figure out something about how a board is supposed to ride.

I actually talked to the guy who distributes TJ Brand in the US, Stephen Kimura (owner of United Shapes), and copy is lifted straight from the Japanese site. He could rewrite it to be grammatically correct, but that's extra work and frankly he (and I) think the Engrish is rather charming. Similar to this sign I saw in Niseko.

 

[robotfood99]

That's a separate issue, though. Moss and Gentem copy is grammatically correct English that says nothing of substance. I'd rather have broken English that actually tells me something.

Gentem has been a purveyor of esoteric descriptions for their rides for a while. Don't know about Moss.

The Far East get grammatically incorrect machine translated marketing spiels from the west that says nothing about how the board rides. Things like "The Orca is no gutless fish." This got translated into something like The Orca has no stomach organs or something to that effect. Poorly translated and carelessly thrown to the bewildered public.

I also think their quirky sense of the English language has a character all it's own. Like this pension in Niseko, The Independence of Republic of Potato.

 

[MrDavey2Shoes]

@robotfood99 I wasn’t saying I don’t understand what they’re saying. I meant what they’re saying means very little to me as I don’t surf. I get that they’re snowsurfs but I need translation into snowboard friendly verbiage.

It’s like describing a color to the sightless. Maybe that’s too far.

 

[kimchijajonshim]

I’m a big mountain guy these days, and just don’t know if these boards will ever be me. Maybe at 55 or so (currently 41)

In good snow, I feel pretty good on my SW 162 at mountains as gnarly as Squaw or Jackson. But in firm conditions, not a chance.

 

[zc1]

Jelly fish is just that, it's a really playful board with center rocker, almost like banana/flying v and so on. It's carvy big brother with similar specs is the fluffy.

The Fluffy was created as a combination of the Jellyfish, C3 and U4 (Naoya's favourite boards in the line). All were meant to be playful and have a very "back foot-controlled" feel. The tight radius on the tail end of the sidecut was meant to make it easier to turn back uphill like making a bottom turn on a wave. The Wing Swallow should also be in this group.

For the pintails I can only speak about what I'm told as I haven't ridden one. They're supposed to be good all-rounders with radial sidecuts, narrower waists and meant to be easy to flick edge-to-edge and drive in powder.

 

[robotfood99]

@robotfood99 I wasn’t saying I don’t understand what they’re saying. I meant what they’re saying means very little to me as I don’t surf. I get that they’re snowsurfs but I need translation into snowboard friendly verbiage.

It’s like describing a color to the sightless. Maybe that’s too far.

My point was that at least they write in readable English. I was addressing @kimchijajonshim's remark about their marketing copy being horseshit.

 

[MrDavey2Shoes]

@robotfood99 ah I see...it kind of is in my opinion...

 

[robotfood99]

@robotfood99 ah I see...it kind of is in my opinion...

Horseshit written in readable English. Totally the norm these days.

 

[SandPounder]

I have no in person experience to any of these boards. How are they different than western brands making that style? For example, how are they different than the Weston Japow, Bataleon Surfer, etc.? Just wondering since I have never ridden any of these boards. Is there a difference in materials or construction methods, or is it just their unique shapes?

Gentemstick are made at the GP87 factory in China. It is a very nice, high quality factory that puts out brands like Weston, Telos, Cardiff, Sims etc. All of the Gentemstick shapes are proprietary to Gentemstick, but there is nothing crazy in them that would command such a high price. You are basically paying for the label and the shape. There is nothing "magical" with their construction methods compared to other brands.

 

[Hatto]

I see it as they are boards made for japans snow conditions, effortless in the deep powder, long slow noses make them climb up ontop, and they turn/carve so well on the soft groomers. When it is ice they behave very differently.
Powder, these boards rock with very little effort required, roosters off the tail in anything over 300mm pow is mindblowing, smooth, quiet and easy. Standing still with Powder up to ya tits, all you have to do is get a little bit on momentum and you pop out up ontop and carve away.
I havent ridden a moss any other place than Japan and don't think i ever will, but a snowsurf board is the only thing i use in Japan.
$1k cost - well over 400 days so far so pretty cheap in my eyes

 

[Hatto]

Another thing i think is how soft/light and dry the Powder is in japan and these shapes are designed for it. Yes other boards/shapes can be used but IMO use right tool for the right job.

 

[zc1]

Another thing i think is how soft/light and dry the Powder is in japan and these shapes are designed for it. Yes other boards/shapes can be used but IMO use right tool for the right job.

Along those lines, Naoya Wada did an info session for a group of us and said that the "Fluffy" was named for the fluffy, soft groomers of Niseko. He said that his goal in designing the board was for it to be his ideal board for his style of riding in Niseko.

 

[Hatto]

Kijima has his boards dialled to Japans conditions. His builds are so good to ride.

 

[treehugger]

I struggle with the fact that other high end boards coming out of the same factory are 1/2 the price. I imagine a smaller market leads to needing to make more profit from each sale and higher cost for smaller production runs. So they may not be overpriced considering but that doesn't quite translate (for me) to being worth it.

However, these boards (Gentlem and Moss) come with some extra prestige (not important to me but still) and I could definitely be ok with paying extra $ to a small innovative brand with a unique vision. The question is how much extra can I justify and what are the other options at more traditional prices. The shapes, dimensions, sidecut, and profiles look great. From what I'm reading fairly soft flex in quality construction. Is there anything special in the flex pattern compared to typical directional: soft in nose getting stiffer in tail? Maybe the magic is in the entirety of it but really want it broken down and understand why these are worth the price. I plan to demo one next season, which I guess, is the only way to know if it's worth it to me.

 

[kimchijajonshim]

All's I'll say is that I have never ridden a Western board that rides like any of my Mosses, including boards out of the GP87 factory.

I know they had some very specific design innovations that are only now gaining traction in the Western scene-- 3D base convex AND concave shaping being the big one --but I have no idea if Moss decks have any specific construction or production techniques to justify that premium. But even if we're just talking about "normal" production methods with specialized shape and design, they have some special magic blend I haven't experienced elsewhere. Like I really enjoy my Westons, United Shapes, and Koruas, but I've ridden other boards that are comparable. The Mosses are just weird little rear-foot driven unicorns. Until Western companies can reliably replicate that feeling (not even that specific feeling, just "wow this is fucking different" feeling), I'm good with paying the premium. (I should caveat that I'm fortunate enough that dropping $1000 on a snowboard versus $500 has essentially no meaningful impact on my financial health, so the "worth" of the premium is definitely relative).

Offhand the only major brand I can think of that's really gone in on that "this is different" vibe is probably Capita / Spring Break... and a frankly some of their more experimental shapes are stupid and gimmicky. Burton I suppose did go in on 3D base shaping this year / with last season's late-season release, and I'm curious to experiment a bit with those if I get a chance.

 

[SandPounder]

I struggle with the fact that other high end boards coming out of the same factory are 1/2 the price. I imagine a smaller market leads to needing to make more profit from each sale and higher cost for smaller production runs. So they may not be overpriced considering but that doesn't quite translate (for me) to being worth it.

However, these boards (Gentlem and Moss) come with some extra prestige (not important to me but still) and I could definitely be ok with paying extra $ to a small innovative brand with a unique vision. The question is how much extra can I justify and what are the other options at more traditional prices. The shapes, dimensions, sidecut, and profiles look great. From what I'm reading fairly soft flex in quality construction. Is there anything special in the flex pattern compared to typical directional: soft in nose getting stiffer in tail? Maybe the magic is in the entirety of it but really want it broken down and understand why these are worth the price. I plan to demo one next season, which I guess, is the only way to know if it's worth it to me.

Gentem and Moss are very specialized brands that cater to a certain type of rider, but there is nothing magical inside the boards that commands a higher price. They do have unique shapes and high quality materials, but they aren't drastically different than any other brand on the market. Gentem and Moss are essentially luxury brands in the snowboard space. Think of Gentemstick as a Gucci or Louis Vuitton hand bag. There is nothing inherently special about LV handbag in terms of raw materials, design, and construction compared to other fashion brands. But consumers pay a premium for prestige of owning a LV bag.