[Nivek]

Knapton is good at one kind of carving. And I've seen him basically state that though can't carve deep on regular width boards. Which he used to ride a Custom X btw. He gets a kickback every time he makes a successful referral to Donek. Keep that in mind if you ever do ask for advice.

Do you think it’s a foot size issue or a technique issue that limits him to super wide boards?

It's a style thing. And I could be full of shit but I feel like he rides like 9/-9 or some shit, which doesnt help.

 

[Craig64]

It's a style thing. And I could be full of shit but I feel like he rides like 9/-9 or some shit, which doesnt help.

Knapton rides a 160, 31.2 WW whilst riding +/-15 with a 9.8m radius sidecut. He rides that wide to prevent boot out whilst getting his board almost 90 degrees on his euro's.:surprise:

Watch heaps of his vid's...., is an insanely shit hot rider for what he does.

 

[bazman]

It is his style. He rides twins with duck stance so he can carve etc in both directions and get the board high on edge. He has duct tape on his jacket arms to allow him to get body parallel to ground when on edge

Has evolved over time wider and wider, and with bigger sidecut as well (Currently 12 or 13m I think)

If you are not switch carving or carving at extreme angles you don't need that type of board

 

[Nivek]

That sidecut is a huge reason his waists are so wide. The larger sidecut you go with the wider you'll need your waist to be to maintain a certain width at inserts.


Which is why we need to stop using the ski measurement of waist width and move to width at inderts.

 

[MrDavey2Shoes]

^preach the good word!

 

[Paxford]

I went from a board designed to carve and ride switch (typical western style all-mountain) to a board designed to snowsurf (Japan style across all conditions). They are not comparable. I'll never ride anything but a dedicated snowsurfer again. My comments below are in blue

I moved to the mountains two season ago and bought my first board (after learning to snowboard twenty years ago)...

Moved from the coast? Do you surf on water? Perspective is everything. I wouldn't recommend a snowsurfer to someone who doesn't have the experience to rail it ... they may be disappointed. It sounds like you are ready for the magic to happen though. I went down a similar road of trying to find a board in the US that'll work best for snowsurfing in ALL conditions, not just pow. I didn't find much help here, folks labeled boards I was looking at as a "pow" quiver board. Built in to the minds of western snowboarders is a resistance to any snowboard not shaped like a pill . People simply aren't breaking down snowsurfing and board design on this forum, I wish they would!

I enjoy ripping big carves and honestly enjoying playing all over the mountain without just straight-lining and bombing. There's a place for it, but I feel that the magic of the turn is what really gets me.

Me too. In snowboarding, surfing, skateboarding and mountain biking I strive to find (or design myself) the perfect weapon to rail turns given my height, weight, skill and terrain. You can't have everything. If turning is what matters most to you then you need to compromise on other design factors, like switch for example.

I do ride a bit of switch, and prefer a board that can at least do it when the need arises (landing switch, easier route through the trees switching over, etc.) ...

Get over it, I did and haven't looked back. Once I had the right board in trees I no longer needed to ride switch. Why? Because the board turns so well. My line choices have increased exponentially. The board will ride switch briefly when needed but that is rare. It'll butter and press too, not great, but it'll do it.

I think the perfect board for me would be something that you size down, can still handle speed, can really hold an edge, has a large sidecut that can rail turns, a bigger nose and maybe some early rise to still handle some pow, and can handle a bit of switch riding (buttering/screwing around too).

I made this mistake too, thinking I could come up with a host of design parameters that would lead me to my perfect board. The board doesn't exist and if it did it probably wouldn't work! Each design parameter effects the rest. My designed board would be like a primordial soup, while a good shapers board is a highly evolved creature. I thought I wanted a larger sidecut like you do, and I was wrong! What I ended up with was a board with less sidecut than I thought I wanted but will still rail long, medium and short radius turns. It'll also break-free and re-engage the edge whenever I please. I'd suggest having faith that your board shaper has taken all the factors in to account in designing a board that turns beautifully.

My current quiver is:

A bunch of boards I too was almost snookered in to buying because they seemed like a fit. So glad I didn't! Although that Ride Warpig is a nice board if they would just narrow up the stance a bit more. I had considered putting my son on that board as a budget compromise to buying a true snowsurfer


Below is my short list which I'm sure I'll add to with your responses, please feel free to comment on any and all if you have experience with them. What other boards would you guys recommend I look at?

Snofisk and SnowPlanks.

I know that a Gentemstick or Moss Snowstick would probably be ideal, but they are a LOT of money.

Unless a swallow tail significantly adds to the ride, I'd prefer a non-swallow for better switch (if that's a thing).

UGGG!!!! So happy with my swallow, but I care about turning. I only turn on average every few seconds from the very top of the run to the very bottom of the run, for like 8 hours a day so I guess it isn't THAT important what the turn feels like :wink: There may be other tails like a pin that'll be more switch friendly but I haven't ridden those on snow and compared to my swallow. All I know is I dislike other tails when I surf on water, but my swallow tail puts a huge grin on my face and works almost everywhere.

- Elevated Surfcraft Goldfish / Redtail Hawk (love the idea of these, but a little pricey if I can't find one used)
- K2 Simple Pleasures
- Korua Shapes - Cafe Racer / Tranny Finder
- United Shaped Cadet
- YES Optimistic (may be too aggressive for what I'm looking for?)

You are on the right track with the Goldfish. Aaron shapes them, nice guy who knows what he is doing and rips at snowsurfing! He is one of the few people I came across in my search here in the states that is actually designing boards I would ride. Also google JH Powwow, you'll find other shapers/designs to ponder

Any and all advice would be great in regards to what I'm looking for.

Contact James Nicole at Snowplanks in Bend Oregon. I ride one of his board designs, the asym fish 166. He designed it around himself and happens to be my approx. height, weight and foot size so I was able to buy off-the-shelf, but once this one wears out I may tweak a thing or two in a custom build (add a few mm width if James thinks it'll work right). If I were you I would look at the asym 159 but check with James. I believe Aaron at SurfCraft is closer to your size so check with him too, he may have something off the shelf that'll work for you

BTW I have a pair of Union Stratas and a Ride Vice bindings if that matters and I'm trying to break in a pair of ThirtyTwo TM-3s in the off-season.

It matters but I don't think it's the end all be all. I ride NOW bindings until I find something better. Definitely replicates the feeling of surfing during turn initiation, and they are responsive. Loose feeling when I need them to be but not sloppy.

Thanks!

 

[Paxford]

I have been through this and continue to search for western boards built to turn like Japanese ones. They turn different. It's hard to quantify.

What I have ridden that let's me get what I feel like is a similar feel to Moss, Gentem, Tj...

K2 Simple Pleaures, Rome Ravine, K2 Overboard, Burton Hometown Hero, Gnu Hyper Kyarve.

A couple I have not ridden but have some high hopes for are the Yes Y and Gnu NuZoid. The Y being a "lower end" Optimistic might make it just soft enough to add the right amount of playfulness. The Zoid would be on this list if Gnu still made it, so the NuZoid being a Zoid mid wide has me very excited.

Great to see someone tapped in to the industry recognize that western boards don't turn like Japanese ones (someone please fix this huge gaping hole in the US market)

I bought my wife a closeout gnu zoid for the upcoming season a few months back. I wasn't certain if it would give her that similar feel but on paper it looked good. I am feeling a bit better about the choice now, counting the days to next season for testing.

 

[jsil]

Thank you everyone for the replies. I'm familiar with Knapton and he's excellent at what he does, but his style of riding really requires BIG empty wide open groomers. He gets out early in the AM before the crowds to film all his stuff. He's also a god at switch and can carve almost as well as regular, but that's not exactly the style I'm after (although if I could ride like him I'd definitely do it!). Honestly its the same reason I'm leaning more towards the Japanese style over the Knapton style or even hard booting.

Paxford -- your thinking mirrors mine and the goldfish and snoplanks asym fish 159 are on my short list. Unfortunately, both of those boards are so pricey (which I understand because of how they are made) so I was hoping to find an alternative without breaking the bank. I did speak with one person who owns gentems, mosses, a goldfish, and asym fish, and a whole host of other boards (thanks!) and definitely think the asym fish would suit me better for all mountain riding than the goldfish. He has never ridden anything with the pop/turn and ride of the asym fish. Is that your experience too? Any other boards you've ridden that can come close?

If a 159 regular asym fish popped up on eBay I'd snap it up in a second, but $800+shipping is a tough pill to swallow (no pun intended).

Thanks!

 

[Paxford]

Sorry for the late reply, work's been crazy.

Nothing comes close but my experience before this is limited to western style boards. The fish feels like a higher volume shortboard built to generate speed easy and turn on a dime in waves up to about 8 ft. It's got some fun and playful flex but will also do short, medium and long radius carves or skidded turns easier than anything I've ridden. It's easy to pump and trim when riding sides of bowls or man-made vertical structure. I like to surf through smaller parks with it, no stops, no switch, just jumps, carving banks and flow. The board is excellent in trees and it will do turns in pow off the front foot. Did I mention it carves up the pow like a hot knife? Ice is a weakness. Asym is good and bad. While it makes the board turn amazing if your straightlining slow on the flats and not paying attention it can drift unexpectedly and catch an edge on ice. Just be aware of it. I try and keep it on edge in ice, in more forgiving snow it isn't a concern.

I never thought I would prefer snowboarding to surfing until I got this board. It's opened up a whole new world that I seem to be pretty alone in, because 95% of folks where I snowsurf (SoCal, Mammoth, Utah) ride straight or skid turns and seem to be focused on park and the industries "All-Mountain" or "Freeride" versions of park. Too much skate focus, not enough surf focus in those designs. A board can't do everything well, but people want it all so that's what the industry delivers ... all-rounders that don't turn as efficiently as they could.

 

[jsil]

Sorry for the late reply, work's been crazy.

Nothing comes close but my experience before this is limited to western style boards. The fish feels like a higher volume shortboard built to generate speed easy and turn on a dime in waves up to about 8 ft. It's got some fun and playful flex but will also do short, medium and long radius carves or skidded turns easier than anything I've ridden. It's easy to pump and trim when riding sides of bowls or man-made vertical structure. I like to surf through smaller parks with it, no stops, no switch, just jumps, carving banks and flow. The board is excellent in trees and it will do turns in pow off the front foot. Did I mention it carves up the pow like a hot knife? Ice is a weakness. Asym is good and bad. While it makes the board turn amazing if your straightlining slow on the flats and not paying attention it can drift unexpectedly and catch an edge on ice. Just be aware of it. I try and keep it on edge in ice, in more forgiving snow it isn't a concern.

I never thought I would prefer snowboarding to surfing until I got this board. It's opened up a whole new world that I seem to be pretty alone in, because 95% of folks where I snowsurf (SoCal, Mammoth, Utah) ride straight or skid turns and seem to be focused on park and the industries "All-Mountain" or "Freeride" versions of park. Too much skate focus, not enough surf focus in those designs. A board can't do everything well, but people want it all so that's what the industry delivers ... all-rounders that don't turn as efficiently as they could.

No problem and thanks for the reply. When you say ice is a weakness, do you mean like sheets of it or just does it not do well in hard early morning conditions before the sun softens them up?

It sounds perfect except for the $800 price... hah

 

[Paxford]

When your on the lift in the morning and all you hear is loud grinding from the folks riding below cautiously (because they fear for their life) that’s the ice I’m talking about. I can still ride it but I can’t push it nearly as hard for fear of washout. I suspect only magnetraction would work ok there. If it’s a a bit Icey but when you lay down an edge it breaks through the granular surface then the board works well enough.

 

[Paxford]

JSIL, what did you end up with? I'm still looking for western boards that are true snowsurfers, not some compromise.

 

[16gkid]

Have you guys tried the K2 simple pleasures yet? Ive been enjoying mine since last season and I think I do the kind of carving you guys are talking about, sweet board and not too expensive.

 

[Paxford]

The K2 SP’s been on my radar since I bought my asym fish last year. I found one on clearance last season for $300. In fact it was my first choice before I discovered the fish. My plan is to compile a bunch of cheaper western boards as options then buy whatever is a smokin deal come the off season.

Is the SP damp? Chatter?

 

[jsil]

JSIL, what did you end up with? I'm still looking for western boards that are true snowsurfers, not some compromise.

I ended up on an Amplid Surfari and it's amazing. Not quite a snowsurf style board because it is an EXTREMELY locked in carve, but this is the best board I've ever ridden. In fact, Amplid has some from a couple years ago for ~$350 w/shipping included from Europe. I paid $640 and I'm still happy with the purchase.

Can't say more about how amazing this board is for carving. Still want to try some other boards, but the rest of my quiver is getting dusty after picking this up.

In my experience, I'd say for carving and pow this is the best bargain in snowboarding.

 

[Jkb818]

I ended up on an Amplid Surfari and it's amazing. Not quite a snowsurf style board because it is an EXTREMELY locked in carve, but this is the best board I've ever ridden. In fact, Amplid has some from a couple years ago for ~$350 w/shipping included from Europe. I paid $640 and I'm still happy with the purchase.

Can't say more about how amazing this board is for carving. Still want to try some other boards, but the rest of my quiver is getting dusty after picking this up.

In my experience, I'd say for carving and pow this is the best bargain in snowboarding.

Just checked it out. Sweet looking deck!

 

[Snowdaddy]

I ended up on an Amplid Surfari and it's amazing. Not quite a snowsurf style board because it is an EXTREMELY locked in carve, but this is the best board I've ever ridden. In fact, Amplid has some from a couple years ago for ~$350 w/shipping included from Europe. I paid $640 and I'm still happy with the purchase.

Can't say more about how amazing this board is for carving. Still want to try some other boards, but the rest of my quiver is getting dusty after picking this up.

In my experience, I'd say for carving and pow this is the best bargain in snowboarding.

That board has been on my radar for a while, it really looks like a nice board.

 

[Yeahti87]

Well, Amplid makes some super solid boards. I’ve been riding my Unw8 163 more and more lately. Trying to fight the urge to buy a 159 for a daily driver. That Antiphase seems to really work on hard crud and soft moguls that you just carve through if your legs can still take that hard work out.

 

[NT.Thunder]

Well, Amplid makes some super solid boards. I’ve been riding my Unw8 163 more and more lately. Trying to fight the urge to buy a 159 for a daily driver. That Antiphase seems to really work on hard crud and soft moguls that you just carve through if your legs can still take that hard work out.
View attachment 152083

What's the Amplid Stereo like as a one board quiver?

 

[Yeahti87]

What's the Amplid Stereo like as a one board quiver?

No idea, I have the UNW8 163 only.